Arcadia Discussion Zone

Each week i am sent a round up of interesting archaeology, and i thought i might start a page detailing the most interesting finds (some may be relevant to RLC and its history, others may just be for fun) ..... its my little hobby horse : ) Feel free to read it and enjoy : )

Biblical Era Royal Seals Found in Jerusalem Hills
Arutz Sheva [Israel], 02/23/09

The Israel Antiquities Authority has announced the discovery of royal
seal impressions from the times of the First and Second Temples. The
finds were made at a site in the southern Jerusalem hills. The seal
impressions are believed to date back to the time of King Hezekiah,
who ruled over Judea in the late eighth century BCE. Four “LMLK”-type
seals were found, as were seals from high-ranking administrators
Ahimelech ben Amadyahu and Yehokhil ben Shahar. One seal impression
combined the LMLK-type seal and the seal of Yehokhil, an occurrence
that archaeologists confirmed is highly unusual. A later inscription,
estimated to have been made 600 years after Hezekiah's reign, was
found on a jar neck. The inscription is believed to date back to the
early Hasmonean period.

http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/130104
See also Israel Ministry of Foreign Affairs:
Short URL: http://snipr.com/cskye
http://www.mfa.gov.il/MFA/Israel+beyond ... oyal-seal-
impressions-discovered-23-Feb-2009.htm?DisplayMode=print

Archaeologists rediscover lost Egyptian tomb
Reuters, Mar 1, 200

Belgian archaeologists have rediscovered an ancient Egyptian tomb
that had been lost for decades under sand, Egyptian Culture Minister
Farouk Hosni said on Sunday. In 1880 Swedish Egyptologist Karl Piehl
uncovered the tomb of Amenhotep, the deputy seal-bearer of the
Pharaoh King Tuthmosis III, in the city of Luxor, about 600 km (375
miles) to the south of the capital Cairo. "It later disappeared under
the sand and archaeologists kept looking for it to no avail until it
was found by the Belgian expedition," a statement from the Supreme
Council of Antiquities quoted Hosni as saying. Egypt's chief
archaeologist Zahi Hawass said the tomb consists of an enclosure and
a large hall divided into two parts by six columns. Part of the
northern side of the hall had been destroyed a long time ago, he added.

http://uk.reuters.com/article/scienceNe ... 1?rpc=401&


Torture pit where Robin Hood was imprisoned found under Nottingham
Galleries of Justice
24 Hour Museum [UK], 26 January 2009

A bottle-necked pit where hated outlaws including Robin Hood were
imprisoned and starved or driven to insanity in the Middle Ages has
been discovered by archaeologists in the underground caves of the
Galleries of Justice Museum in Nottingham. Known as an oubliette (“to
forget” in French), the hole was used as a holding cell for
dissenters against the Sheriff of Nottingham, and the city’s
favourite wealth-regulating son is believed to have been cast into it
after being arrested by the Sheriff and his men at the nearby St
Mary’s Church. “The opening was bricked over centuries ago, probably
in the Georgian period,” explained the Museum’s Cathy Rowson, who
managed to photograph the pit by standing in the structure and
pointing the lens skywards. Currently access to the oubliette is by a
side tunnel that was knocked through, probably during the original
excavations in 1998.”

http://www.culture24.org.uk/history/art66257

A farmer has spent more than 30 years building a scale model of a
biblical temple – and admits it won't be finished in his lifetime.
Alec Garrard has hand-baked and painted every clay brick and tile of
his replica of Herod's Temple – which measures 6m (20ft) by 3.6m
(12ft). The 78-year-old has also sculptured 4,000 tiny human figures
to populate the courtyards. 'It will never be finished as I'm always
finding something new to add,' said Mr Garrard, from Norfolk. 'I have
an interest in buildings and religion so I thought maybe I could
combine the two. I'd seen one or two examples of it in biblical
exhibitions but I thought they were rubbish and I knew I could do
better.'

Short URL: http://snipr.com/cskbd
http://www.metro.co.uk/news/article.html?
Worlds_finest_replica_of_temple_took_me_30_years_to_build..._and_its_sti
ll_not_finished&in_article_id=560096&in_page_id=34

Now that's what I call a labour of love!





Thanks for this,

VAM

Thanks Bergère, .........there's also a large thread entitled "Archeological cover-ups" for those that take the alternative stance!

Give it Biff!

bergeredearcadie great little bits of archaeology info....thanks for posting.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/ ... -Eden.html

Wow Sheila,

These are impressive. Not the Garden of Eden bit, but these wonderful stones. I cant believe they are dated that old .... i am going to have to investigate these : )

Hi Sandy....absolutely!....something worth reading up on here me thinks.

Isnt archaeology wonderful?

It's certainly is. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hill_O_Many_Stanes These stones might not be in the Gobleki class but I have a particular interest in them as my great-grandmother was born a half mile from them.

Really nice thread guys.

Thanks for starting it Sandy. Interesting.

Andrew

NEWS RELEASE
March 5, 2009


Manhattan District Attorney Robert M. Morgenthau today announced the arrest of a 49-year-old man for creating multiple aliases to engage in a campaign of impersonation and harassment relating to the Dead Sea Scrolls and scholars of opposing viewpoints.

http://manhattanda.org:80/whatsnew/pres ... 3-05.shtml

The Dead Sea Scrolls consist of roughly 900 documents, including texts from the Hebrew Bible, discovered between 1947 and 1956 in 11 caves in and around the ancient ruins of Qumran, on the northwest shore of the Dead Sea, in present-day Israel. The texts are of great religious and historical significance, as they include the only known surviving copies of biblical texts made before 100 A.D., and preserve evidence of considerable diversity of belief and practice within late Second Temple period Judaism, the Judaism of the second and first centuries B.C. and the first century A.D. These manuscripts generally date to between 150 B.C. and 50 A.D. Publication of the scrolls is now complete, however it was delayed for many decades.

Vatican menorah called an urban myth

Written by Marshall Shapiro
Tuesday, 03 March 2009


HAMILTON – It was myth busting time in Hamilton as Yeshiva University historian, Dr. Stephen Fine, explained recently to an awestruck crowd filling the home of Rabbi Aaron and Leslie Selevan that no, the menorah from the Temple in Jerusalem is not being sequestered in the Vatican and that the pyramids of Egypt had already been built – at least 400 years earlier – by the time Joseph arrived and Moses led his people out.
“But,” he declared, “We did build the Coliseum in Rome.” Fine describes himself as an archaeologist and artist in a world of rabbis at Yeshiva U.

The temple treasures have been the subject of speculation through the ages. It is known that they were removed from the Temple by the Romans circa 66 CE. It is also known that they were taken to Rome and displayed in a pageant-like parade led by a large party carrying images of victory, all made of ivory and gold. According to Dr. Fine, behind them drove Vespasian, followed by Titus while Vespasian’s son, Domitian rode beside them, in magnificent apparel and mounted on a steed that was itself a sight.

It is believed the treasures remained in the Temple of Peace in Rome until the city was sacked by the Visigoths under Alaric I in 410 CE.

There are descriptions of the menorah and depictions of it in Rome but is it still in the Vatican?

“Absolutely not,” said Fine, a renowned historian who has spent years investigating the menorah and other Jewish treasures.

He said that Jewish scholars have had complete access to the Vatican libraries and storage areas.

“If the Catholics had the menorah they would be charging admission to see it,” he said.
The story of the menorah being horded by the Vatican, he explained, originated in the 20th century and is traceable to New York and nowhere else.

“It’s a bubba meiseh,” he said, “a grandmother’s tale.”

One possible explanation is the conflict between Jewish and Italian immigrants who occupied the same economic and demographic niche. There was, he said, a basic distrust and dislike between Jews and Italians and thus the theft of the menorah by the symbolic head of the Irish immigrants’ religion was a form of theological libel akin to the blood libels against the Jews throughout history.

We know where it was in the year, 200 CE, said Fine, but most likely, the menorah was looted by the Vandals in the sacking of Rome in 455 CE, and taken to their capital, Carthage. The Byzantine army under General Belisarius might have removed it in 533 and brought it to Constantinople. According to Procopius, it was carried through the streets of Constantinople during Belisarius’ triumphal procession.

Procopius adds that it was later sent back to Jerusalem where there is no record of it, although it could have been destroyed when Jerusalem was pillaged by the Persians in 614. Being of solid gold there is every reason to believe that it was melted down, a fate that befell many gold valuables.

As to the building of the Coliseum – among other Roman edifices – the emperor, Titus, brought 20,000 Jewish slaves to Rome and in the Arch of Titus is depicted a menorah as part of the captured Jewish treasure from Jerusalem. To this day, the Talmud forbids Jews from walking under the Arch.

Holes in the walls of the Coliseum are still visible in the surface, clearly corresponding to rivets holding bronze lettering reading “Imp. T. Cael Vespasianus Aug. Ampitheatrum Novum Ex Maunbis Freiri lussit” which translates to “The Emperor Caesar Vaspasian Augustus had his new amphitheatre erected with the spoils of war.” That war is believed to be the battle for Jerusalem. Two years after the sack of Jerusalem, in AD 72, work on the Coliseum, officially known as the Flavian Amphitheatre, began.

Once construction had been completed, according to findings by Toronto documentary maker, Simcha Jacobovici, there was a glut of slaves in Rome and so Jews were able to buy their way out of servitude for very low cost.

http://www.jewishtribune.ca/TribuneV2/i ... -myth.html

One important question - the historian says Procopius recorded the procession of the Menorah through the streets of Constantinople.
If Alaric had taken the treasure in 410AD (from Rome), how did it end up back in Rome for the Vandals to sack in 455AD?

Or are they suggesting that the Menorrah and other treasures were somehow missed by Alaric?

The reconstructions by archaeologists of the Temple of Peace surely show that Alaric would not have missed this treasure!!

This is the question I posed to Roger early this morning....because when Constantine built his new Capital on the foundations of Byzantium he took ALL the Roman ( read Worldly) treasures he & Rome had amassed and took everything lock stock & barrel to his new-built capital city Constantinople.

Great minds think alike...and I wasn't only talking about the Candlestick that is properly named a Lamp.........

To the west of the Augustum lay the Forum of Constantine, elliptical in form and surrounded by noble colonnades, which terminated at either end in a spacious portico in the shape of a triumphal arch. In the centre, which, according to an old tradition, marked the very spot on which Constantine had pitched his camp when besieging Licinius, stood, and still stands, though in sadly mutilated and shattered guise, the Column of Constantine, which has long been known either as the Burnt Pillar, owing to the damage which it has suffered by fire, or as the Porphyry Pillar, because of the material of which it was composed. There were eight drums of porphyry in all, brought specially from Rome, each about ten feet in height, bound with wide bands of brass wrought into the shape of laurel wreaths. These rested upon a stylobate of white marble, some nineteen feet high, which in turn stood upon a stereobate of similar height composed of four spacious steps. Sacred relics were enclosed—or are said to have been enclosed—within this pediment, including things so precious as Mary Magdalene's alabaster box, the crosses of the two thieves who had suffered with Christ upon Mount Calvary, the adze with which Noah had fashioned the Ark out of rough, primeval timber, and—in strange company—the very Palladium of ancient Rome, transported from the Capitol to an alien and a rival soil. At the foot of the column there was placed the following inscription: "0 Christ, Ruler and Master of the world, to Thee have I now consecrated this obedient city and this sceptre and the power of Rome. Guard and deliver it from every harm."

At the summit of the column was a colossal statue of Apollo in bronze, filched from Athens, where it was believed to be a genuine example of Pheidias. But before the statue had been raised into position, it suffered unworthy mutilation. The head of Apollo was removed and replaced by a head of Constantine. This may be interpreted as a confession of the sculptors of the day that they were unable to produce a statue worthy of their great Emperor; but the fact that a statue of Apollo was chosen for this doubtful honor of mutilation is worth at least passing remark, when we remember that before his conversion Constantine had selected Apollo for special reverence. It is certainly strange that the first Christian Emperor should have been willing to be represented, on the site which was ever afterwards to be associated with his name, by a statue round which clustered so many pagan associations. He did not even disdain the pagan inscription, "To Constantine shining like the Sun"; nor did he reject the pagan attribute of a radiated crown around the head. In the right hand of Apollo the old Greek artist had placed a lance; in the left a globe. That globe was now surmounted by a cross and lo! Apollo had become Constantine; the most radiant of the gods of Olympus had become the champion of Christ upon earth. The fate of this statue—which was held in such superstitious reverence that for centuries all horsemen dismounted before passing it, while below it, on every first day of September, Emperor, Patriarch, and clergy assembled to chant hymns of prayer and praise—may be briefly told. In 477 the globe was thrown down by an earthquake. The lance suffered a like fate in 541, while the statue itself came crashing to earth in 1105, killing a number of persons in its fall. The column was then surmounted by a cross, and fire and time have reduced it to its present almost shapeless and unrecognizable mass.

Close to the Augustum there began to rise the stately magnificence of the Imperial Palace, the Great Palace, as it was called to distinguish it from all others. This was really a cluster of palaces spread over an enormous area, a self-contained city within itself, strongly protected with towers and walls. Here were the Imperial residences, gardens, churches, barracks, and baths, and for eight hundred years, until this quarter was forsaken for the palace of Blacherna in another region of the city, Emperors continued to build and rebuild on this favored site. In later years the Great Palace consisted of an interconnected group of buildings bearing such names as Chrysotriklinon, Trikonchon, Daphne,—so called from a diviner's column brought to Constantinople from the Grove of Daphne near Antioch,—Chalce, Boucoleon, and Manavra. One at least of these dated back to Constantine. This was the Porphyry Palace, with a high pyramidal roof, constructed of porphyry brought especially from Rome. It was dedicated to the service of the ladies of the Imperial Family, who retired thither to be away from the vexations, intrigues, and anxieties of everyday life during the time of their pregnancy.

Here's a good easily laid out site about the man & his mission.

http://www.third-millennium-library.com ... AT/13.html

Here's is the depiction of the Menorah on the Arch of Titus..



We have no knowledge as to what happened to the menorah afterwards. It disappeared, and all subsequent rumours are mere speculation. One such theory is that the Vandals under Gizerik removed many treasures from Rome when they captured the city in the year 455 C.E., and that among them was the menorah. According to this theory, when their kingdom was destroyed in turn, and Carthage was conquered by Belisarius, commander of the Byzantine army under the Emperor Justinian, the menorah was taken to Constantinople and kept in the emperor's palace.


.....Unless Constantine had already taken it to Constantinople when he set up home there.......and/or the depiction of the object we call the Menorah has got confused?

Rather depends on how reliable Procopius as a historian

I read this article about the Menorah a while ago and thought it was interesting.......at one time i thought it was this that was hidden at RLC

http://www.chabad.org/library/article_c ... enorah.htm

And Constantinople itself was looted in 1204 by the hooligans and barbarians of the Fourth Crusade. For instance, the four great brass horses which were situated in the Hippodrome are now to be found in St Mark's Basilica in Venice.

Maybe this depiction was chosen only to symbolize that the Romans got the jewish treasure so folks could understand the message ... and the Menorah could have been stolen allready before the Romans showed up as Jerusalem was looted a few times before that.

Listen up Mr E.....please don't quote me out of context unless you have read my posts and understand where I'm coming from.......thank you.

Elongated skulls discovered....in Russia.

http://www.boingboing.net/2009/03/03/el ... s-dis.html

Classic gags discovered in ancient Roman joke book
The Guardian [UK], March 2009

We may admire the satires of Horace and Lucilius, but the ancient
Romans haven't hitherto been thought of as masters of the one-liner.
This could be about to change, however, after the discovery of a
classical joke book. Celebrated classics professor Mary Beard has
brought to light a volume more than 1,600 years old, which she says
shows the Romans not to be the "pompous, bridge-building toga
wearers" they're often seen as, but rather a race ready to laugh at
themselves. Written in Greek, Philogelos, or The Laughter Lover,
dates to the third or fourth century AD, and contains some 260 jokes
which Beard said are "very similar" to the jokes we have today,
although peopled with different stereotypes – the "egghead", or
absent-minded professor, is a particular figure of fun, along with
the eunuch, and people with hernias or bad breath. "They're also
poking fun at certain types of foreigners – people from Abdera, a
city in Thrace, were very, very stupid, almost as stupid as [they
thought] eggheads [were]," said Beard.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/2009/ma ... book-beard

'An ancient version of Monty Python's dead parrot sketch sees a man buy a slave, who dies shortly afterwards. When he complains to the seller, he is told: "He didn't die when I owned him."

Beard's favourite joke is a version of the Englishman, Irishman, Scotsman variety, with a barber, a bald man and an absent-minded professor taking a journey together. They have to camp overnight, so decide to take turns watching the luggage. When it's the barber's turn, he gets bored, so amuses himself by shaving the head of the professor. When the professor is woken up for his shift, he feels his head, and says "How stupid is that barber? He's woken up the bald man instead of me."

"It's one of the better ones," said Beard. "It has a nice identity resonance ... A lot of the jokes play on the obviously quite problematic idea in Roman times of knowing who you are." Another "identity" joke sees a man meet an acquaintance and say "it's funny, I was told you were dead". He says "well, you can see I'm still alive." But the first man disputes this on the grounds that "the man who told me you were dead is much more reliable than you".

"Interestingly they are quite understandable to us, whereas reading Punch from the 19th century is completely baffling to me," said Beard.

But she queried whether we are finding the same things funny as the Romans would have done. Telling a joke to one of her graduate classes, in which an absent-minded professor is asked by a friend to bring back two 15-year-old slave boys from his trip abroad, and replies "fine, and if I can't find two 15-year-olds I will bring you one 30-year-old," she found they "chortled no end".

"They thought it was a sex joke, equivalent to someone being asked for two 30-year-old women, and being told okay, I'll bring you one 60-year-old. But I suspect it's a joke about numbers – are numbers real? If so two 15-year-olds should be like one 30-year-old – it's about the strange unnaturalness of the number system."

Beard, who discovered the title while carrying out research for a new book she's working on about humour in the ancient world, pointed out that when we're told a joke, we make a huge effort to make it funny for ourselves, or it's an admission of failure. "Are we doing that to these Roman jokes? Were they actually laughing at something quite different?" .'

Thanks Sandy
I never thought I'd laugh at a 2000 year old gag, mind you I find Jimmy Carr funny
Regards
Nic

A link to the Smithsonian website on the 15 Must-See endangered cultural treasures.



link :- http://microsite.smithsonianmag.com/con ... endangered

Regards
Nic