Arcadia Discussion Zone

Millennial Temple Model of Ezekiel's Vision

http://www.sonstoglory.com/ThirdTempleE ... Temple.htm

Norton,
Excellent link full of information...thanks for posting it...
By the way, at another forum topic here, Sheila remarked that Palestinians were being "picked on" and treated badly by Jews.. and they (Palestinians) were entitled to "their" land...hmmmm
Perhaps she would be interested in the link you sent:

http://www.sonstoglory.com/ThirdTempleEzekielsMillennialTemple.htm

Scroll down to section 5...Israel's Land Divisions. I personally think Jews have every right to be there...as much as the Irish have to Ireland and the Scotts have to Scotland....I best not say more on this touchy topic as I am unprotected and lack bullet-proof vest.

I found this very interesting website explaining the Elohim that should tickle your fancy Norton:
http://www.yrm.org/sons_of_elohim.htm

It substantiates much of what you have stated here previously.

All the best,
Shasta

'Scuse me...the fact that the Israeli War machine is bombing the fuck out of innocent civilians while the world looks on doesn't bother you!!

We should stay out of territorial disputes that do not concern us.

The Jewish (zionists) claim that Israel belongs to them based on the Bibical claim that God promised the land to Abraham and his descendants.
The Palestinians claim it belongs to them by the simple fact of their continuous residence repeated through birth and possession going back to the earliest Canaanites and even those people living there before recorded history.

These arguments have been heard throughout recent history, with more support given to the Jewish claim through the efforts of the Lobby in the States and constant support from most of the western governments. The Palestinians do not have a Lobby on their side, they rely on fairness in the press to present their side of the ’story’. This does not happen often, but there is a growing number of resources that do present their views and in many cases support them as well.

This is a stalemate situation. What the F*** does it matter if you don't live there?

Just a wee thought for the oppressed people in one corner of our globe....have you never been oppressed?

I personally think Jews have every right to be there...as much as the Irish have to Ireland and the Scotts have to Scotland

No one is saying the Jews dont have a right to be there. The indigenous Jewish population of course. The indigenous 'Palestinians', as i understand it, got resentful when Jews not even born there wanted to come back and live there, and take the land of the people that were living there already.
Is that fair?

Anyway, the issue is not about that - it is really about what Israel is doing to the population living there now.

http://video.google.com:80/videoplay?do ... 8578139565

Regarding who is to be there, or who isnt to be there ....and who should be there and who shouldnt bethere:

How about some genetic studies - seeing as everyone is into facts and sceinece and proof:

"Results of a DNA study by geneticist Ariella Oppenheim in 2000 matched historical accounts that Arab Israelis and Palestinians, together as the one same population, represent modern "descendants of a core population that lived in the area since prehistoric times", albeit religiously Christianized and later largely Islamized, then both ultimately becoming culturally Arabized. Referring to those of the Muslim faith more specifically, it reaffirmed that Palestinian "Muslim Arabs are descended from Christians and Jews who lived in the southern Levant, a region that includes Israel, Sinai and part of Jordan." Geneticist Michael Hammer praised "the study for 'focusing in detail on the Jewish and Palestinian populations.'" The study proposes that:

...More than 70% of Jewish men and half of the Arab men whose DNA was studied inherited their Y chromosomes from the same paternal ancestors who lived in the region within the last few thousand years...found that the Y chromosome in Middle Eastern Arabs was almost indistinguishable from that of Jews.

While both the Palestinians and the world's distinct Jewish populations have mixed with invading and host populations respectively, Oppenheim's team found "that Jews have mixed more with other populations, which makes sense because they were more likely to leave the Levant.".

In genetic genealogy studies, Palestinians and Negev Bedouins have the highest rates of Haplogroup J1 (Y-DNA) among all populations tested (62.5%). Semitic populations, including Jews, usually possess an excess of J1 Y chromosomes compared to other populations harboring Y-haplogroup J.The haplogroup J1, associated with marker M267, originates south of the Levant and was first disseminated from there into Ethiopia and Europe in Neolithic times. In Jewish populations J1 has a rate of around 15%, with haplogroup J2 (M172) (of eight sub-Haplogroups) being almost twice as common as J1 among Jews (<29%). J1 is most common in the southern Levant, as well as Syria, Iraq, Algeria, and Arabia, and drops sharply at the border of non-semitic areas like Turkey and Iran. A second diffusion of the J1 marker took place in the seventh century CE when Arabians brought it from Arabia to North Africa.

Haplogroup J1 (Y-DNA) includes the modal haplotype of the Galilee Arabs (Nebel et al. 2000) and of Moroccan Arabs (Bosch et al. 2001) and the sister Modal Haplotype of the Cohanim, the "Cohan Modale Haplotype", representing the descendents of the priestly caste Aaron. J2 is known to be related to the ancient Greek movements and is found mainly in Europe and the central Mediterranean ( Italy, the Balkans, Greece). According to a 2002 study by Nebel et al., on Genetic evidence for the expansion of Arabian tribes, the highest frequency of Eu10 (i.e. J1) (30%–62.5%) has been observed so far in various Muslim Arab populations in the Middle East. (Semino et al. 2000; Nebel et al. 2001). The most frequent Eu10 microsatellite haplotype in Northwest Africans is identical to a modal haplotype of Muslim Arabs who live in a small area in the north of Israel, the Galilee. (Nebel et al. 2000) termed the modal haplotype of the Galilee (MH Galilee). The term “Arab,” as well as the presence of Arabs in the Syrian desert and the Fertile Crescent, is first seen in the Assyrian sources from the 9th century B.C.E. (Eph'al 1984).

In recent years, many genetic surveys have suggested that, at least paternally, most of the various Jewish ethnic divisions and the Palestinians — and in some cases other Levantines — are genetically closer to each other than the Palestinians or European Jews to non-Jewish Europeans (a European sample from the Welsh).

However, Nebel et al. (2001) report that Jews were found to be more closely related to north of the Fertile Crescent (Kurds, Turks,Iraqis and Armenians) than to their Arab neighbors. While the Arabs were found to be related to Arabian Peninsula.The study proposes that:

...the Y chromosomes in Palestinian Arabs and Bedouin represent, to a large extent, early lineages derived from the Neolithic inhabitants of the area and additional lineages from more-recent population movements. The early lineages are part of the common chromosome pool shared with Jews. According to our working model, the more-recent migrations were mostly from the Arabian Peninsula, as is seen in the Arab-specific Eu 10 chromosomes that include the modal haplotypes observed in Palestinians and Bedouin... The study demonstrates that the Y chromosome pool of Jews is an integral part of the genetic landscape of the region and, in particular, that Jews exhibit a high degree of genetic affinity to populations living in the north of the Fertile Crescent."

So, the conclusions?

The conclusions are this: Jews and Palestinians are human beings, and what is going on now by Israel is disproportionate and as noted by others, Israel commit war crimes .....

Using the basis of a 'religion', or ancient history, to commit war crimes is morally wrong and people should stand up and be counted ...

Well said that girl.

This is a stalemate situation. What the F*** does it matter if you don't live there?

Paul, i thought in regards to RLC and its research .... you just wanted facts etc, and there is nothing wrong in that. People called you igonorant .... and i wasnt sure that that should be applied to you ...

But actually, to say the above statement totally shows the ignorance you have regarding the Middle Eastern conflict. So why not RLC research too?

Havent you a clue about how the conflict WILL INDEED affect us all in the end ...

And as i write this, Israel has indeed invaded the Gaza strip. Dont tell me Israel does not have an ulterior motive. As Shiela said, its a 'land grab' in masquered....

No one is doing anything about it. Its really sad : (

Is the blood of an Israeli child worth less than the blood of a Palestinian child? The public is influenced by the side with the best propaganda machine, not the best claim to "rights", and the Arab interests have produced a very successful propaganda machine with your oil dollars...They have influenced everything in efforts to Islamize the world, bringing Shariat into Democracies, enforcing slavery and lack of equal rights for women, et cetera...If you feel such empathy for the Palestinians then I suggest you go live there....I hope you pick a lovely shade of black for your burkha...

By the way in Thailand the Muslims regularly slash throats of young Buddhist monks bicycling to their temples..not quite the same as Palestinians lobbing bombs into Israel daily, but causes just as much grief, blood, and death of civilian populations...and Thai Government has to put up with as much as Israeilis in terms of violence against its population.
You see, the south of Thailand is having same problems as Israel and Gaza...the Muslims are trying to get land seperated from Thailand by destroying everything Buddhist and democratic, but when they are blamed, they cry foul and discrimination...oh yea, same as they do in Kashmir and in Swat-NW Frontier of Pakistan. They are using tactics that have always worked for them before around the world.

http://www.masada2000.org/historical.html


The Real War Against Israel...

The Middle East wars are not now and never was a conflict between Israelis/Jews on the one hand and Palestinians on the other. In fact, the Arab-"Palestinians", while currently the perpetrators of most of the anti-Jewish atrocities, were never a very important part of the conflict. In fact, before about 1970, virtually no one in the world considered the Middle East conflict to be one between Israelis and Palestinians.

The term "Palestinian" itself had referred to Israeli Jews back in the 1940s, and had been slowly deconstructed and redefined to refer to the Arabs in the West Bank and Gaza. This is due to efforts of Yasar Arafat who inflamed the Palestinians by inventing the whole concept of a "Palestian" people...he totally made that up and milked it for billions of dollars in publicity and aid money that always got siphoned off to his private bank accounts around the world...

The Middle East Conflict was always a war by Arabs against Jews, not a conflict between Israelis and "Palestinians." The war was repackaged as a conflict between Jews and Palestinians as a public relations gimmick by the Arab fascist regimes. These regimes had never had any interest in "Palestinians," in creating a "Palestinian" state, or in "Palestinian nationalism" before 1967. That is because Palestinian nationalism did not and DOES NOT exist. The Palestinians were a regional group of Arabs having virtually no cultural nor national distinctive traits separating them from Syrians, Lebanese, and Jordanians. They are all basically Arabs!.

The bulk of what are called "Palestinian Arabs" are members of families who migrated into the Land of Israel beginning in the late 19th century as simple farm laborers. Palestinian nationalism is a mislabeling of Arab nationalism. Arab nationalism exists, although it is closely bound up with Islamic nationalism and even Islamism. Palestinian nationalism, however, is a phantom. It is nothing more than genocidal hatred of Jews!

The Arab assaults and aggressions against Israel in 1948, 1956, 1967, 1968, and 1973 had nothing to do with Palestinians. The Palestinian terror campaign would itself be easy to suppress today and eradicate if the Middle East conflict were really a Palestinian-Israeli conflict. Israel would simply obliterate the terrorists and expel their supporters to Syria and Lebanon. The Middle East war continues because it is really an Arab-Israeli war, not an Israeli-Palestinian conflict. It is also in large part a war between barbarism and civilization. In many ways an Islamic religious jihad against the Jews.

The hatred for not only Jews but all infidels is spouted every day in every way in all Islamic enviornments. You support Palestine now to your regret later...when they curse you and spit on you, dear infidel..perhaps living there for a few years would be the best move you could make.. or try the relief camps in Afghanistan, or go to Swat and Panir Valley and live there among those who generate such hatred, the Muslims themselves...I doubt they'd even let you live in Saudie Arabia. Are you willing to give up driving and go outside only with a male family member who must drive you everywhere? "If" you make it that far as an unbiased reporter, then please do return here and tell us what you think is based on reality at ground zero. See the hatred close up and personal and tell us how bad the democratic Jews and Zionists are then...no dear, it is not about Zionism nor about Jews...it is about th ultimnate goals of Islam to have your neck on the block next.
__________________________________________

Islamic Terror Attacks During the Past Two Months

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/index.html#Attacks
1/2/2009 Somalia Mogadishu 9 0 Two soldiers and seven civilians are killed in an Islamic bombing and the ensuing fire fight.
1/2/2009 Iraq al-Yusufiyah 23 110 A Fedayeen suicide bomber wades into a lunch crowd at a reconciliation meeting between Sunni and Shia leaders, killing twenty-three.
1/1/2009 Pakistan Peshawar 3 6 Three policemen are killed by two Religion of Peace bombs.
1/1/2009 Pakistan Swat 3 0 Three people are shot to death by Islamic terrorists in separate attacks.
1/1/2009 Pakistan Bajaur 4 16 Four civilians are killed when Mujahideen fire rockets into an office complex.
1/1/2009 Iraq Mosul 3 5 A suicide bomber takes out three Iraqis.
1/1/2009 Somalia Afgoye 1 0 A journalist is killed during an attack by Islamic militia.
12/31/2008 Pakistan Darra Adamkhel 4 6 Three women and a child are killed when Muslim terrorists fire a rocket into their home.
12/31/2008 Philippines General Santos 0 22 Moro Islamists toss a grenade into a New Years Eve celebration, injuring over twenty.
12/31/2008 Denmark Odense 0 2 A Muslim shoots two Jewish vendors at a shopping mall.
12/31/2008 Somalia Baidoa 1 0 A woman is shot to death by Islamic fundamentalists over an 'illicit' relationship.
12/31/2008 Pakistan Mir Ali 1 0 A 28-year-old man is kidnapped and murdered by the Taliban.
12/31/2008 Afghanistan Helmand 21 0 A mother pleading for her son's life is among twenty-one persons shot in cold blood by the Taliban.
12/31/2008 Philippines Bagong 1 0 Moro Islamists gun down a civilian.
12/31/2008 Iraq Baghdad 14 66 Four members of a religious minority are among fourteen killed by Islamists in four attacks.
12/30/2008 Philippines Esperanza 1 0 A 17-year-old Christian taxi driver is killed by a bomb planted by Muslim radicals.
12/30/2008 Iraq Jalawla 1 0 Suspected al-Qaeda gun down a tribal leader.
12/30/2008 Pakistan Mingora 1 0 A local official is assassinated by Muslim militants.
12/29/2008 Iraq Mosul 1 0 A suicide bomber takes out a shopper at a grocery.
12/29/2008 Israel Ashkelon 1 7 Hamas rockets hit an Israeli home, killing a resident.
12/29/2008 Afghanistan Kabul 2 17 Two Afghan civilians are blown to bits by a Fedayeen suicide bomber.
12/29/2008 Israel Ashdod 1 1 A mother of four is killed by a Palestinian rocket.
12/29/2008 Iraq Mahaweel 3 0 A mother and daughter are among three people killed by Sunni bombers.
12/29/2008 Pakistan Gwalirai 2 0 Two men, abducted days earlier, are murdered in captivity by the Taliban.
12/29/2008 Thailand Pattani 1 1 A woman is shot to death on her way to work by Muslim terrorists. Three others are killed elsewhere.
12/29/2008 Somalia Mogadishu 5 10 At least five civilians are killed, including a young child, when Islamists bomb a market.
12/28/2008 Pakistan Miranshah 3 0 Three young civilians, including an 18-year-old, are kidnapped and hung by Taliban militants.
12/28/2008 Iraq Mosul 4 20 A 12-year-old boy is among four civilians taken out by a suicide bomber on a bicycle.
12/28/2008 Iraq Fallujah 4 10 Four Iraqis are murdered in two Jihad bombings.
12/28/2008 Afghanistan Khost 16 58 Fourteen children on their way to school are deliberately murdered along with two adults by a suicidal Sunni bomber.
12/28/2008 Pakistan Buner 43 16 Religious extremists take out over forty people at a polling station with car bombs. Five children are among the dead.
12/28/2008 Thailand Yala 1 0 Islamic gunmen murder a man in a tea shop.
12/27/2008 Afghanistan Kandahar 5 5 Five Afghans are blown up by a Fedayeen suicide bomber.
12/27/2008 Afghanistan Kabul 3 0 Three teenage sisters are crushed to death by a Taliban rocket barrage.
12/27/2008 Iraq Baghdad 24 45 Women and children are among two dozen people blasted to death by Jihadi car bombers.
12/27/2008 Israel Netivot 1 4 Hamas rockets kill an Israeli man and injure four others.
12/26/2008 Pal. Auth. Beit Lahiya 2 0 Two young girls are killed when a Palestinian rocket hits their home.
12/26/2008 Pakistan Bajaur 1 9 A child is killed during a Taliban rocket attack.
12/26/2008 India Kishtwar 1 0 Mujahideen abduct a man, then murder him in a wooded area.
12/26/2008 Pakistan Gilgit 5 0 A child is among five people shot dead in a sectarian ambush.
12/25/2008 Iraq Bishkan 1 1 A 13-year-old is murdered in her home by Jihadi invaders.
12/25/2008 Iraq Baghdad 4 24 Sunni extremists bomb a restaurant, killing four patrons.
12/25/2008 Iraq Muqdadiyah 3 12 A Fedayeen suicide bomber takes out three other people.
12/24/2008 Philippines Kalamansig 1 0 Moro Islamists fire at a motorboat, killing a passenger.
12/24/2008 Iraq Fallujah 3 4 Three children are killed in a suspected al-Qaeda roadside attack.
12/24/2008 Pakistan Lahore 1 4 Muslim bombers take out a woman along a city street.
12/23/2008 Pakistan Swat 4 0 A man and his wife are among four people murdered by Mujahideen in three attacks.
12/23/2008 Thailand Pattani 1 7 An Islamist shooting and bombing leave one dead and seven injured.
12/23/2008 Iraq Kifl 1 0 A man is kidnapped and tortured to death by Religion of Peace militants.
12/23/2008 Iraq Mosul 2 6 A child and doctor are murdered by Islamic terrorists.
12/23/2008 Iraq Tarmiyah 5 4 A man and his wife are among two people blasted to death by Jihad bombers.
12/23/2008 Philippines Isabela 0 26 Abu Sayyaf members toss two grenades into a group of people enjoying a musical performance.
12/23/2008 Pakistan Mingora 2 0 A beggar woman and her daughter are gunned down at point-blank range by Holy Warriors.
12/23/2008 Philippines Sultan Kudarat 9 8 Moro Islamists storm two villages and shoot nine civilians to death.
12/22/2008 Somalia Mogadishu 7 22 Seven civilians are killed during an attack by Islamic guerrillas
12/22/2008 India Baramulla 2 0 Two local soldiers are shot to death at close range by Muslim assassins at a market.
12/22/2008 Afghanistan Ghazni 3 4 A suicide bomber takes out three civilians.
12/22/2008 Pakistan Swat 6 8 Two women are among six civilians killed by Mujahideen in three incidents.
12/21/2008 Thailand Pattani 1 0 A 50-year-old civilian is murdered by Muslim gunmen on his way home.
12/21/2008 Pakistan North Waziristan 2 0 Two brothers are brutally kidnapped and murdered by Sunni extremists.
12/21/2008 Pakistan Swat 3 0 Mujahideen drag three people out of their home and shoot them in cold blood. The victims include a man and his son.
12/21/2008 Pakistan Bannu 2 0 Islamic militants rocket a government building, killing two people.
12/20/2008 Thailand Pattani 1 7 A woman standing outside a convenience store is murdered by Islamic bombers. Children are injured as well.
12/20/2008 Thailand Yala 1 0 A 49-year-old security guard is shot to death by Muslim radicals as he leaves his home.
12/19/2008 Somalia Mogadishu 1 10 A civilian is shot to death during an attack by Jabalu Islamiya terrorists.
12/19/2008 Pakistan Khyber 3 0 Three civilians are killed when Sunni militants open fire on an empty fuel tanker.
12/19/2008 Iraq Baghdad 7 0 Islamists behead seven Iraqis.
12/18/2008 Iraq Kirkuk 1 0 A female women's rights activist is beheaded in her home by Islamic terrorists.
12/18/2008 Pakistan Hangu 4 1 A child is among four peope shot to death by Islamists in three attacks.
12/18/2008 Iraq Diyala 2 17 Two Iraqis are taken out by roadside bombers.
12/18/2008 Philippines Iligan 3 47 Islamists detonate nail-packed bombs at two shopping malls in Christian areas, killing at least three people.
12/17/2008 Pakistan Wana 1 0 A civilian is shot to death by religious extremists.
12/17/2008 Thailand Yala 1 0 A 16-year-old boy is shot to death outside of a 7-Eleven by Mujahideen.
12/17/2008 Pakistan Matta 2 0 Taliban militants abduct and kill two locals.
12/17/2008 Pakistan Jamrud 1 1 A woman is killed, and a child injured, in a Taliban rocket attack on a vehicle.
12/17/2008 Pakistan Kanju 2 0 A couple is murdered for having unmarried sex.
12/17/2008 Iraq Baghdad 18 53 Eighteen innocent souls are snuffed out by Jihadi bombers along a city street.
12/16/2008 Thailand Pattani 2 0 Two young guards escorting a teacher are gunned down by Muslim radicals.
12/16/2008 Pakistan Swat 2 0 Islamic terrorists gun down two people in separate attacks.
12/16/2008 Iraq Baghdad 1 3 A 13-year-old child is taken out by Islamic bombers.
12/16/2008 Iraq Mosul 8 16 Two suicide bombings leave eight Iraqis dead.
12/16/2008 Iraq Baghdad 3 15 Jihadis place a bomb near a college campus, killing three people.
12/16/2008 Thailand Yala 3 1 Muslim terrorists shoot three people to death at a market, including a woman
12/15/2008 Thailand Narathiwat 2 1 A 4-year-old child is among three people shot by Islamists in two attacks.
12/15/2008 Iraq Khan Dhari 9 31 Nine Iraqi police are blown apart by a Fedayeen car bomber at a checkpoint.
12/15/2008 Iraq Sinjar 7 3 Women and children are among seven members of a religious minority sect slaughtered in their home by suspected Sunnis.
12/15/2008 Thailand Yala 1 0 A 53-year-old man is gunned down in front of a food shop by Islamic terrorists.
12/15/2008 Pakistan Swat 6 3 Six locals are murdered - two beheaded - by Taliban fundamentalists in three attacks.
12/15/2008 Iraq Tarmiya 1 1 A female suicide bomber takes out an Iraqi man and seriously injures his son.
12/14/2008 Afghanistan Paktika 1 0 A musician is kidnapped and killed by Taliban fundamentalists for defying a ban on music.
12/14/2008 Pakistan Jamrud 2 1 Mujahideen shoot two tribal elders to death along a road.
12/14/2008 Pakistan Mandal Daag 9 3 Sunni extremists murder a rival cleric and eight of his followers.
12/14/2008 Afghanistan Kandahar 3 11 Three Afghans are murdered by a Taliban bomb hidden in a street vendor cart.
12/13/2008 Philippines Basilan 3 3 A woman is among three people murdered in their home by Moro Islamists.
12/13/2008 Pakistan Miranshah 2 0 Islamists slit one man's throat and shoot another to death.
12/13/2008 Pakistan Matta 4 0 Four tribesmen are shot to death by the Taliban.
12/13/2008 India Doda 1 2 Mujahideen gun down a woman in her home.
12/13/2008 Pakistan Swat 5 0 Five civilians are killed in a terrorist landmine attack.
12/12/2008 Thailand Yala 3 3 Three border guards are killed when Islamic militants open up on them with automatic weapons.
12/12/2008 Thailand Pattani 1 2 Jihadis kill a man and seriously injure two others with a planted bomb in a karaoke bar.
12/11/2008 Yemen Reida 1 0 A Jewish leader is gunned down by a Muslim shouting, 'Jew, receive the message of Islam.'
12/11/2008 Somalia Mogadishu 10 11 Children are among ten people killed during an attack by Islamic militia.
12/11/2008 Iraq Kirkuk 55 120 Fifty-five Iraqis are blown to bits at a restaurant by Shahid suicide bombers.
12/11/2008 Afghanistan Helmand 4 1 Religious extremists trick a 13-year-old boy into carrying explosives to British troops, which were then detonated remotely.
12/11/2008 Pakistan Matta 3 4 Tehrik-e-Taliban terrorists gun down three locals.
12/10/2008 Iraq Jalawla 1 2 A civilian is taken out in a Jihad bomb blast.
12/9/2008 Philippines Maguindanao 1 8 A local soldier is killed when Moro Islamists open fire on them with automatic weapons.
12/9/2008 Pakistan Buner 1 4 A 10-year-old child is murdered by a Fedayeen suicide bomber.
12/8/2008 India Bharatpur 2 0 A man reclaims his honor by shooting his daughter and her boyfriend after learning of their sexual relationship.
12/7/2008 Iraq Baquba 3 39 Jihadis kill three Iraqis with a bomb hidden in a shop.
12/7/2008 Pakistan Peshawar 1 0 The Taliban murder a local security guard at a depot.
12/6/2008 Somalia Baidoa 3 0 An Islamic militia member tosses a grenade into a market, killing three civilians.
12/6/2008 Afghanistan Kunar 4 2 Four local soldiers are killed when religious extremists attack their vehicle with a roadside bomb.
12/6/2008 Pakistan Swat 3 0 Three civilians are gunned down by suspected Taliban.
12/6/2008 Iraq Babel 4 0 Four children are killed by a landmine planted near a soccer field by suspected Sunnis.
12/6/2008 Iraq Kirkuk 1 15 A Fedayeen suicide bomber kills only one other person.
12/6/2008 Iraq Wajihiya 3 4 al-Qaeda gunmen attack a Sunni village, killing three people.
12/5/2008 Pakistan Peshawar 34 131 Twenty-nine people at a marketplace are blown to bits by sectarian car bombers.
12/5/2008 Pakistan Orakzai 10 5 Religious extremists take out ten shoppers at a bazaar with a suicide blast.
12/5/2008 Pakistan Bannu 2 3 Taliban militants kill two policemen with a rocket attack.
12/5/2008 Pakistan Mir Ali 1 0 Sunni extremists abduct and murder an 30-year-old man.
12/5/2008 Thailand Narathiwat 5 12 Five people are killed at a grocery by Islamic bombers.
12/5/2008 Iraq Baghdad 2 2 Mujahideen bombers take out two Iraqis.
12/4/2008 Pakistan Bahawalpur 1 0 A young girl is clubbed to death by her uncle on suspicion of 'illicit relations.'
12/4/2008 Iraq Albu Toma 25 0 Twenty-five al-Qaeda victims are found in mass graves.
12/4/2008 Afghanistan Khost 5 10 Five people are killed in two suicide attacks by Sunni extremists.
12/4/2008 Iran Bluchistan 16 0 Jundullah terrorists kidnap and execute sixteen Iranian nationals.
12/4/2008 Iraq Fallujah 15 147 Women and children are among fifteen Iraqis blasted to death by Jihadi car bombers.
12/4/2008 Thailand Pattani 2 0 A 60-year-old man is among two people gunned down by Muslim separatists.
12/4/2008 Dagestan Khasavyurt 1 0 A woman is killed by Islamic car bombers outside an apartment building.
12/3/2008 Chechnya Grozny 3 0 Three people are shot inside their home by suspected Mujahideen.
12/3/2008 Iraq Albu Toma 13 0 Thirteen victims of al-Qaeda kidnappings are found in a mass grave.
12/3/2008 Pakistan Shabqadar 5 6 Five locals are killed by a Fedayeen car bomber.
12/2/2008 Pakistan Sunpag 1 0 Religious extremists abduct a local official, keep him for a few days, then slaughter him and stuff his body in a bag.
12/2/2008 Pakistan Kabal 1 0 A civilian is shot to death by Islamic terrorists.
12/2/2008 Dagestan Makhachkala 1 4 Suspected Muslim militants gun down a cop.
12/2/2008 Iraq Mosul 4 12 Two young children are among four killed when Mujahideen place a bomb outside a school.
12/2/2008 Iraq Tal Afar 5 30 Jihadis successfully kill five Iraqis with a car bomb.
12/1/2008 Afghanistan Ghazni 1 0 A local official is assassinated by religious extremists.
12/1/2008 Pakistan Peshawar 2 0 Taliban militants attack a supply convoy, killing two drivers.
12/1/2008 Thailand Yala 1 0 Muslim terrorists gun down a rubber tapper in his orchard.
12/1/2008 Iraq Baghdad 16 35 Sixteen police recruits are murdered by two Jihad bombers at their academy.
12/1/2008 Iraq Mosul 15 25 A Fedayeen suicide bomber takes out fifteen civilians along a city street.
12/1/2008 Afghanistan Musa Qala 10 25 Ten shoppers are blown up by a suicide bomber at a market.
12/1/2008 Pakistan Swat 11 66 Women are among the casualties of a horrific suicide attack on a traffic checkpoint. Eleven are killed.
11/30/2008 Pakistan Bannu 6 5 Six local police are killed in two Taliban ambushes.
11/30/2008 Afghanistan Kabul 2 3 A streetsweeper is among two civilians blown up by a suicide bomber.
11/30/2008 Pakistan North Waziristan 1 0 The Taliban abduct and murder an Afghan civilian.
11/30/2008 Pakistan Peshawar 1 1 A local driver is killed when Sunni militants lob rockets into a terminal.
11/30/2008 Dagestan Makhachkala 4 0 Muslim gunmen shoot four people to death.
11/29/2008 Iraq Baghdad 3 12 Three people are murdered by an Iranian-made rocket fired by Mujahideen.
11/29/2008 Iraq Mosul 3 18 Two brothers are among three killed in an attack on a jewelry shop by Sunni terrorists.
11/29/2008 Somalia Baidoa 2 10 Two people are killed in blasts by suspected Islamic milita.
11/29/2008 Chechnya Enginoy 1 0 A woman is shot to death over suspected immoral behavior.
11/29/2008 Iraq Albu Toma 38 0 Thirty-eight victims of sectarian violence within the Religion of Peace are found in a mass grave.
11/28/2008 Nigeria Jos 2 0 Two Christians are macheted to death after a cleric inspires his followers to 'kill unbelievers."
11/28/2008 Nigeria Jos 6 0 Six Christian pastors are among hundreds killed when Muslim rioter stage a deadly church-burning rampage.
11/28/2008 India Mumbai 5 0 Five Jewish hostages, including a rabbi and his wife, are murdered by Islamists.
11/28/2008 Pakistan Gharibabad 6 0 Three women and a child are among six member of a family murdered in their home by the Mujahideen.
11/28/2008 Iraq Kut 1 2 A child is killed when Muslim militants fire a rocket into a home.
11/28/2008 Iraq Mussayab 12 18 Twelve people at a mosque are blown to bits by rival sectarian bombers.
11/28/2008 Pakistan Bannu 7 16 Six civilians and a cop are murdered by a suicide bomber along a city street.
11/28/2008 Iraq Baghdad 2 10 A Fedayeen suicide car bomber kills two civilians.
11/27/2008 Afghanistan Badghis 13 11 Thirteen local security personnel are killed in an ambush by religious extremists.
11/27/2008 Iraq Mosul 2 28 Suicide bombers successfully take out two Iraqi civilians.
11/27/2008 Pakistan Swat 6 0 Six people are shot to death by Sunni extremists in separate attacks, including a brutal abduction.
11/27/2008 Afghanistan Kabul 4 18 A suicide car bomber takes out four local civilians outside the US embassy.
11/26/2008 Philippines Makir 1 3 Moro Islamists ambush a group of local soldiers guarding a highway, killing one.
11/26/2008 Dagestan Makhachkala 1 0 A border guard is shot and killed by Muslim militants.
11/26/2008 India Mumbai 178 370 Mujahideen throw grenades and machine-gun over one-hundred and fifty civilians and tourists to death as they attack several sites, including a hotel, cafe, market and train station.
11/26/2008 Iraq Diyala 23 0 Twenty-three victims of sectarian terrorists are found in a mass grave.
11/26/2008 Iraq Samarrah 6 0 Six people are murdered by local Jihadists.
11/26/2008 Pakistan Peshawar 2 6 Two residents are killed when the Taliban fire rockets into their home.
11/26/2008 Chechnya Grozny 6 0 Six women are shot in the head and chest over suspected immorality in separate attacks.
11/26/2008 Russia Vladikavkaz 1 0 A mayor is assassinated by local terrorists, who call him an "enemy of Allah."
11/26/2008 Dagestan Khasavyurt 1 2 A police officer is gunned down outside a mosque by Jihad terrorists.
11/25/2008 India Mumbai 4 0 Islamic terrorists hijack a boat in Pakistan and kill the four man crew.
11/25/2008 Iraq Mosul 2 5 Two Americans are shot to death while handing out humanitarian aid.
11/25/2008 Somalia Baidoa 1 0 A local officer is shot several times in the chest by Islamists at a market.
11/25/2008 Pakistan Hangu 4 9 Shia militants open fire in a hotel, murdering eight Sunni rivals.
11/25/2008 India Baramulla 1 2 A 14-year-old boy is killed when Islamists throw a grenade into a roadshow.
11/25/2008 Pakistan Matta 3 5 A butcher is among three people gunned down by the Taliban in separate attacks.
11/25/2008 Pakistan Shahdra 1 0 A Muslim lad hacks his stepmother to death with an axe over 'illicit relations.'
11/25/2008 Pakistan Kohat 0 0 Four persons, including a mother and child, are killed when sectarian Jihadis fire into a vehicle.
11/24/2008 Thailand Yala 3 1 Islamists gun down three civilians and severely injure a teacher in separate attacks.
11/24/2008 Pakistan Kabal 1 0 Mujahid assassinate a local political activist.
11/24/2008 India Doda 1 0 A civilian is murdered in his home by Muslim terrorists.
11/24/2008 Iraq Baghdad 5 24 A female suicide bomber takes out five Iraqis.
11/24/2008 Iraq Baghdad 13 6 Women and children are heavily represented in the thirteen bus passengers massacred by Mujahideen bombers.
11/24/2008 Pakistan Mingora 1 0 Religious extremists execute a woman in her home for immoral behavior.
11/24/2008 Dagestan Karabudakhent 2 3 Muslim rebels open fire on a group of policemen, killing two.
11/23/2008 Iraq Muwaylaha 9 0 Nine kidnap victims of an Islamic milita are found in a mass grave.
11/23/2008 Chechnya Sadovyi 5 4 Mujahideen murder five security personnel and a civilian in two attacks.
11/23/2008 Ingushetia Nazran 1 0 Islamic militants kill an off-duty cop at a grocery store.
11/22/2008 Afghanistan Khost 2 15 A 15-year-old boy and a man are blown to bits when Holy Warriors bomb a vegetable market.
11/22/2008 Afghanistan Kunar 0 0 After being held in captivity for three months, the Taliban execute a local official when their demands are not met.
11/22/2008 Iraq Iskandariya 10 0 Two women are among ten people found executed in a mass grave in a Sunni stronghold.
11/22/2008 Somalia Mogadishu 15 75 At least fifteen civilians are killed in attacks by Islamic militias on security forces.
11/22/2008 Pakistan Bannu 3 0 A Taliban rocket attack on a police post leaves three dead.
11/22/2008 Ingushetia Nazran 1 0 A cafe worker is gunned down by Muslim rebels.
11/22/2008 Pakistan Hangu 5 8 Two children are among five killed when Islamists set a bomb off inside a rival mosque.
11/22/2008 Afghanistan Kabul 1 1 Sunni extremists kill a French de-miner with a landmine.
11/22/2008 Afghanistan Ghazni 1 0 A local civilian is captured and shot to death by Sunni radicals.
11/22/2008 Pakistan Mingora 1 0 Religious extremists burn down a video store and shoot a civilian to death.
11/21/2008 Pakistan Dera Ismail Khan 11 40 Radical Sunnis gun down a Shia cleric, then bomb his funeral, murdering eight others.
11/21/2008 Afghanistan Zabul 3 4 Three civilians are blown to bits by a suicide car bomber.
11/21/2008 Somalia Mogadishu 9 20 Five children are among nine civilians killed in a rolling series of attacks by Islamic militia in residential areas.
11/21/2008 Iraq Baghdad 3 15 Mujahideen take out three Iraqis with a roadside bomb.
11/21/2008 Pakistan Hangu 1 0 Religious extremists fire a rocket at a checkpoint, killing a policeman.
11/21/2008 Iran Tehran 1 0 A 43-year-old businessman is tortured by police into a "confession" then executed as a spy.
11/20/2008 Afghanistan Khost 8 13 A Fedayeen suicide bomber detonates outside an office building, sending eight Afghans to Allah.
11/20/2008 Iraq Kut 5 0 Sunni extremists invade a home and kill five residents, including children.
11/20/2008 Iraq Mosul 5 0 Two women are among five people murdered by terrorists while sitting in their vehicle.
11/20/2008 Pakistan Bajaur 9 6 A suicide bomber enters a rival mosque and takes out nine innocents.
11/19/2008 Dagestan Buynaksk 1 0 A local cop is gunned down by suspected Muslim militants.
11/19/2008 Yemen Joaar 5 0 al-Qaeda terrorists gun down four local cops and a civilian.
11/19/2008 Pakistan Islamabad 2 0 Two men are shot to death by Mujahideen along a city street.
11/18/2008 Thailand Pattani 2 0 Two Buddhists are shot to death by Muslim militants, who then mutilate the bodies and take amputated arms.
11/18/2008 Thailand Pattani 1 1 Mujahideen gun down a woman and her son on their way to work at a plantation.
11/18/2008 Thailand Yala 1 1 Islamists gun down a soldier shopping at a local market as well as his wife, who came to his defense.
11/18/2008 Iraq Baghdad 15 0 Fifteen bodies are found beneath a house controlled by the militia of a Shiite cleric.
11/17/2008 Thailand Pattani 3 0 A 73-year-old woman is among three civilians murdered by Religion of Peace gunmen in separate attacks.
11/17/2008 Thailand Pattani 1 0 A 44-year-old security guard is shot three times by Islamic terrorists while riding his motorbike.
11/17/2008 Thailand Narathiwat 1 1 A civilian is killed, and his 8-year-old daughter badly injured, when Islamic gunmen fire on their pickup truck.
11/17/2008 Afghanistan Farah 6 4 Talibanis ambush a group of local soldiers, shooting some and beheading others.
11/17/2008 Ingushetia Nazran 1 1 Islamic separatists shoot a married couple in their car, killing the man and putting his wife in the hospital.
11/17/2008 Afghanistan Kandahar 4 8 Religious extremists murder four civilians with a roadside bomb.
11/17/2008 Pakistan Swat 4 3 Four Pakistanis are blown apart by a suicide car bomber.
11/17/2008 Afghanistan Dand 3 2 Three Afghans are murdered by a suicide bomber.
11/16/2008 Iraq Baghdad 3 6 Jihadis manage to kill three Iraqis with a roadside bomb.
11/16/2008 Somalia Baidoa 3 10 A child and two women are blown to bits by Muslim bombers at a marketplace.
11/16/2008 Iraq Jalawla 15 20 A Fedayeen detonates himself in a crowd, sending fifteen innocent souls to Allah.
11/16/2008 Thailand Pattani 1 0 Islamists shoot a man to death outside a mosque.
11/16/2008 Thailand Yala 1 0 A young man is murdered outside his home by Muslim gunmen.
11/16/2008 Somalia Mogadishu 2 2 Islamists open fire on a car, killing two businessmen.
11/16/2008 Pakistan Anayat Kalley 1 0 A tribal elder is killed in a brutal ambush by a group of Taliban.
11/15/2008 Somalia Yaqshid 2 0 Two civilians are killed during an ambush by Islamic extremists.
11/15/2008 Iraq Tal Afar 9 40 Mujahideen plant a car bomb at a car dealership, killing nine employees and customers.
11/15/2008 Iraq Baghdad 3 25 Three people are killed when terrorists detonate a bomb near a theatre.
11/15/2008 Philippines Sarangani 2 0 Moro Islamists murder two local soldiers with a landmine.
11/14/2008 Afghanistan Khost 3 0 Three construction workers are shot to death by Sunni extremists.
11/14/2008 Pakistan Ramora 2 0 A young man is forced by honor to kill his sister and her lover after finding them in a compromising position.
11/13/2008 Philippines Mindanao 3 0 A 5-year-old boy is among three civilians killed by Moro Islamists during an assault.
11/13/2008 Iraq Ramadi 4 3 A Fedayeen suicide bomber murders four people.
11/13/2008 Afghanistan Nangarhar 9 74 Islamic suicide bombers hit a livestock market, sending nine innocents to Allah.
11/13/2008 Dagestan Urguba 1 1 Suspected Islamists gun down a local cop at point-blank range.
11/12/2008 Pakistan Charsadda 6 15 A half dozen people are murdered by a Fedayeen suicide car bomber.
11/12/2008 Afghanistan Kandahar 6 42 Six people are killed when a suicide bomber flattens a commercial district.
11/12/2008 Afghanistan Kandahar 0 3 Religious extremists spray three teenage schoolgirls with acid while they are walking to school.
11/12/2008 Iraq Mosul 2 0 Two Christian sisters are shot to death inside their home by Muslim militants.
11/12/2008 Pakistan Peshawar 2 0 An American humanitarian worker and his driver are murdered by Islamic radicals.
11/12/2008 Iraq Baghdad 21 87 Nearly two dozen Iraqis are successfully killed by Mujahideen bombers in three attacks.
11/12/2008 Afghanistan Farah 1 0 A religious cleric who condemned suicide bombings is kidnapped and executed in captivity by the Taliban.
11/11/2008 Pakistan Peshawar 4 13 A suicide bomber murders four people outside a sports stadium.
11/11/2008 Thailand Yala 2 0 Two laborers are shot to death by Islamic militants in separate attacks.
11/11/2008 Thailand Pattani 2 0 A 79-year-old woman is murdered along with her son by Muslim terrorists as she is walking home.
11/11/2008 Iraq Baghdad 3 15 Mujahideen target newpaper vendors with bombs, killing at least three.
11/11/2008 Thailand Pattani 1 0 A Buddhist civilian is shot to death at close range by Islamists.
11/10/2008 Thailand Narathiwat 1 5 Islamists kill a local soldier with a roadside bomb.
11/10/2008 Iraq Baqubah 7 12 al-Qaeda sends a 13-year-old female suicide bomber to a gathering where seven people are killed.
11/10/2008 Pakistan Orakzai 1 9 Sunni extremists fire on a passenger bus, killing one person.
11/10/2008 Dubai Umm Suqeim 1 1 A brother stabs his sister's lover to death in an honor killing. (The woman is also stabbed, but survives).
11/10/2008 Iraq Baghdad 30 68 Two Sunni suicide bombers massacre thirty Shia civilians outside a fine arts school.
11/9/2008 Algeria Jijel 1 0 Islamic fundamentalists murder a 52-year-old civilian.
11/9/2008 Pakistan Matta 1 0 A woman is pumped full of bullets after being found guilty of adultery by a Sharia court.
11/9/2008 Iraq Fallujah 3 5 Two woman and a 10-year-old girl are blown to bits by a Fedayeen suicide bomber.
11/9/2008 Philippines Pikit 2 3 A 12-year-old boy and 10-year-old girl are brutally gunned down by Islamic extremists.
11/9/2008 Philippines Maguindanao 2 0 Two locals are abduted and shot to death by Moro Islamists.
11/9/2008 Afghanistan Herat 2 4 A suicide bomber yells 'Allah Akbar' then detonates along a highway, killing two Spanish soldiers.
11/8/2008 Somalia Jamame 1 0 A aid worker, whose agency helps construct roads, is murdered by Islamic militia.
11/8/2008 Pakistan North Waziristan 2 0 Two civilians are abducted, then riddled with bullets by religious extremists.
11/8/2008 Somalia Lego 3 0 Al-Shabab terrorists kidnap and behead three local soldiers.
11/8/2008 Algeria Naciria 1 0 A young man delivering bread is shot and beheaded by Islamic fundamentalists.
11/8/2008 Iraq Ramadi 8 12 A double suicide bombing by Fedayeen leave eight Iraqis dead.
11/7/2008 Pakistan Changa Manga 1 0 A 15-year-old girl is stabbed to death by her brother on suspicion of sexual relations.
11/7/2008 Afghanistan Ghor 1 1 Talibanis assassinate a local official.
11/7/2008 Iraq Baghdad 6 12 Two Jihad bombings leave six civilians dead.
11/7/2008 Pakistan Mingora 2 11 Two local security personnel are dismembered by a suicide bomber.
11/6/2008 Pakistan Khar 22 45 Fedayeen suicide bombers take out over twenty people at a gathering of tribal elders.
11/6/2008 Iraq Mosul 1 0 A young woman is shot to death by suspected fundamentalists over immoral activity.
11/6/2008 Russia Vladikavkaz 11 40 A female suicide bomber strikes at a marketplace busstop, murdering at least eleven passengers.
11/6/2008 Algeria Cabilia 1 0 A popular mayor is kidnapped, executed and then burned by Islamic fundamentalists.
11/6/2008 Thailand Yala 1 0 The 47-year-old widow of a murdered man is herself gunned down by Muslim militants.
11/5/2008 Pakistan Waziristan 5 0 Five civilians are hanged by religious fundamentalists.
11/5/2008 Thailand Yala 1 0 A school janitor on his way to work is shot to death by Islamic extremists.
11/5/2008 Pakistan FATA 1 0 Mujahideen abduct and murder a local official.
11/5/2008 Somalia Mogadishu 1 3 Islamic militia kill a local guard with a hand grenade.
11/5/2008 Iraq Baghdad 6 12 Six people are blown to bits by a suicide bomber at an airport.
11/4/2008 Thailand Yala 3 0 A 16-year-old boy is among three people ambushed and murdered by Muslim terrorists in separate attacks.
11/4/2008 Pakistan Hangu 7 6 Seven people are killed by a Fedayeen suicide bomber.
11/4/2008 Pakistan Swat 1 0 The Taliban tie a policeman to a pole and shoot him to death.
11/4/2008 Pakistan Orakzai 1 0 An elderly man is gunned down by Sunni extremists.
11/4/2008 Iraq Madaen 3 0 A woman and two children are killed when terrorists lob a mortar into their home.
11/4/2008 Iraq Baghdad 18 47 Eighteen Iraqis are killed in at least four Jihad bombings.
11/4/2008 Pakistan Mardan 2 2 Two policemen are shot at point blank range by Muslim militants.
11/4/2008 Thailand Narathiwat 1 72 Islamists bomb a marketplace and a tea shop, killing at least one innocent and injuring over seventy.



We are tired of the arrogance, excuses, and whiny demands.
It's time for Muslims to take responsibility and end the violence.

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/index.html#Attacks
Previous Years:

Islamic Terror Attacks for First Part of 2008

Islamic Terror Attacks for 2007

Islamic Terror Attacks for 2006

Islamic Terror Attacks for 2005

Islamic Terror Attacks for 2004

Islamic Attacks from September 11th, 2001 through 2003

oh, i can see exactly where you are coming from with a post like that ....

The public is influenced by the side with the best propaganda machine,

Please watch the film made, at this link:

http://video.google.com:80/videoplay?do ... 8578139565

and then perhaps we can have a discussion.

Shasta,

the facts you posted here are not in dispute.......but...

The aerial bombings and the ongoing invasion of Gaza by Israeli ground forces must be analysed in a historical context. Operation "Cast Lead" is a carefully planned undertaking, which is part of a broader military-intelligence agenda first formulated in 2001:

"Sources in the defense establishment said Defense Minister Ehud Barak instructed the Israel Defense Forces to prepare for the operation over six months ago, even as Israel was beginning to negotiate a ceasefire agreement with Hamas

It was Israel which broke the truce on the day of the US presidential elections, November 4:

"Israel used this distraction to break the ceasefire between itself and Hamas by bombing the Gaza strip. Israel claimed this violation of the ceasefire was to prevent Hamas from digging tunnels into Israeli territory.

The very next day, Israel launched a terrorizing siege of Gaza, cutting off food, fuel, medical supplies and other necessities in an attempt to "subdue" the Palestinians while at the same time engaging in armed incursions.

In response, Hamas and others in Gaza again resorted to firing crude, homemade, and mainly inaccurate rockets into Israel. During the past seven years, these rockets have been responsible for the deaths of 17 Israelis. Over the same time span, Israeli Blitzkrieg assaults have killed thousands of Palestinians, drawing worldwide protest but falling on deaf ears at the UN." Planned Humanitarian Disaster

On December 8, US Deputy Secretary of State John Negroponte was in Tel Aviv for discussions with his Israeli counterparts including the director of Mossad, Meir Dagan.

"Operation Cast Lead" was initiated two days day after Christmas. It was coupled with a carefully designed international Public Relations campaign under the auspices of Israel's Foreign Ministry.

Hamas' military targets are not the main objective. Operation "Cast Lead" is intended, quite deliberately to trigger civilian causalities.

What we are dealing with is a "planned humanitarian disaster" in Gaza.

The longer term objective of this plan, as formulated by Israeli policy makers is the expulsion of Palestinians from Palestinian lands:

"Terrorize the civilian population, assuring maximal destruction of property and cultural resources... The daily life of the Palestinians must be rendered unbearable: They should be locked up in cities and towns, prevented from exercising normal economic life, cut off from workplaces, schools and hospitals, This will encourage emigration and weaken the resistance to future expulsions"

We could go round and round with who is at fault and who broke what truce.....I was a volunteer in Israel during the Six Day War..I flew there from Paris when Israel was attacked...
In part the reason for the so-called "occupation" was no different than today's reason for entering Gaza.,
Jews had to endure horrific and unmitigated attacks against civilians who also could not leave their homes and had their children killed. Showing the "violence" against Palestinians without showing the horrific butchering that Palestinians committed daily against Israelis...Arafat and the PLO were given billions in aid for Palestinians which was promptly siphoned off for their own private accounts, meanwhile holding up the poor Palestinian suffering, lack of food and medical care as somehow all the fault of Israel.
I am not buying it.
The greed and stupidity of the PLO and now Hamas....the deliberate destruction of sacred sites like the tomb of Joseph and the tomb of Abraham and Sarah, the desecration and hoped for destruction of the Church of the Nativity which also lies within so-called Palestinian territories..you have no idea how much the Palestinian PLO and Hamas try to beat the Jews into oblivion, or, as they say, into the sea forever.

If this was just a conflict between Israel and Palestinians, I might be inclined to take a middle road. However, this is an Islamic pattern of attack and cry foul that exists worldwide, orchestrated by Wahabis who have unlimited oil wealth for their propaganda efforts. When you support Palestinians, you are supporting a well funded world-wide Islamic long term plan to rule the world. The rhetoric used by Palestinians is same used by Muslims in Kashmir and Thailand...in African nations and in Australia. I am not buying into this scheme for world-wide domination by Islam, grabbing land a sliver at a time like a choke-hold on the world , a noose that will gradually tighten..I will not support this.

Shasta

WHO ARE THE PALESTINIANS?
WHAT & WHERE is PALESTINE?


There has never been a civilization or a nation referred to as "Palestine" and the very notion of a "Palestinian Arab nation" having ancient attachments to the Holy Land going back to time immemorial is one of the biggest hoaxes ever perpetrated upon the world! There is not, nor has there ever been, a distinct "Palestinian" culture or language. Further, there has never been a Palestinian state governed BY Arab Palestinians in history, nor was there ever a serious Arab-Palestinian national movement until 1964... three years BEFORE the Arabs of "Palestine" lost the West Bank [Judea and Samaria] and Gaza as a result of the 1967 Six-Day War (which the Arabs started). Even the so-called leader of the "Palestinian" people, Yasser Arafat, is EGYPTIAN! In short, the so-called Arab "Palestinians" are a manufactured people...a people with no history and no authenticity... whose sole purpose for existence is to destroy the Jewish State.
Israel first became a nation in 1312 B.C.E., two thousand years before the rise of Islam! Seven hundred and twenty-six years later in 586 B.C.E. these first ancient Jews in the Land of Israel [Judea] were overrun and Israel's First Jewish Temple (on Jerusalem's Old City Temple Mount) was destroyed by Nebuchadnezzar, king of ancient Babylon. Many of the Jews were killed or expelled; however many were allowed to remain. These Jews along with their progeny and other Jews who would resettle over the next 500 years, rebuilt the Nation of Israel and also a Second Temple in Jerusalem upon the Temple Mount. Thus the claim that Jews suddenly appeared fifty years ago right after the Holocaust and drove out the Arabs is preposterous!



Then in 70 C.E. (nearly 2000 years ago), it was the Roman Empire's turn to march through ancient Israel and destroy the SECOND Jewish Temple, slaughtering or driving out much of its Jewish population. Many Jews left on their own because conditions for life were made unbearable in many respects... yet thousands upon thousands stayed and rebelled on for centuries in order to once again rebuild a Jewish Nation in this Holy Land.

Over 3250 years, various Peoples, Religions and Empires marched through Jerusalem, Israel's ancient capital. The region was successively ruled by the Hebrews [Jews], Assyrians, Babylonians, Persians, Greeks, Maccabeans, Romans, Byzantines, Arabs, Egyptians, the Crusaders, Mamelukes, the Turks (who indifferently governed the backward, neglected territory from the 16th century until the British drove them out during World War I) and then once again by the Jews in 1948. None bothered, nor were they in the least bit inclined, to build a Nation of their own... EXCEPT the Jews!

It must be noted that in 636 C.E., when the Arabs marauders came to the land and uprooted even more of its Jews, they did not form any Arab nation there... and certainly not a "Palestinian" nation. They were simply "Arabs" who, as did others before them, moved into a geo-political area called "Palestine!" And remember this one fact... it was not the Jews who "usurped" (a favorite word from the Arab propagandists) the land from the Arabs. If anything, it was the Arabs in 636 C.E. who overran and stole it from the Jews!

In Conclusion:

No nation, other than the ancient nation of Israel and later again in 1948 with the rebirth of the 2nd Nation of Israel, has ever ruled as a sovereign national entity on this land. A mighty Jewish empire extended over this entire area before the Arabs --- and their Islam --- were even born! The Jewish People have one of the most legitimate Birth Certificates of any nations in the world. Every time there is an archaeological dig in Israel, it does nothing but support the fact that the Jewish People have had a presence there for well over 3,000 years. The national coins, the pottery, the cities, the ancient Hebrew texts... all support this claim. Yes, other peoples have passed through, but there is no mistaking the fact that Jews have always had a continual presence in that land for over 3,000 years. This predates and certain dwarfs any claims that other peoples in the regions may have. The ancient Philistines are extinct. Many other ancient peoples are extinct. They do not have the unbroken line to this date that the Jews have.
source:http://www.masada2000.org/

Does this word help????

"OCCUPATION"

Whats the point of quoting from a so obviously biased viewpoint as that web site???

The whole argument of that web site has nothing to do with anything. Using racism, religion and whatever else they can to crush an indigenous people. Its called 'ethnic cleansing'.

Talking the way you are, without any REFERENCE to the fact that Israel invaded ..... is to not show the FULL picture.

I gave you 'scientific' evidence that supported the notion that most Jews and Palestinians are from the same 'gene pool', that they have the same common ancestors. Is that not good enough?

Fundamentalist Islam has nothing to do with it. Not all Muslims are fundamentalists. You are buying into a fear created by the US and Israel. Its rediculous. We actually have alot to thank Islam for, throughout history.

We are talking about what is happening NOW. And Israel is an invading and occupying military DICTATORSHIP, supported by her closest ally, America.

If the policy being followed by Israel at the moment, is so right, why is there so much opposition? How do you explain this? In fact, why are these views never heard?

http://yellowcakewalk.net/israeli_peace_movement.html

or especially this, people who know more than any of us what is really going on:

http://couragetorefuse.org/English/default.asp

I'll just quote here what the above organisation is: 'January 2002, a group of Israeli reserve officers and combat soldiers returned from their duty in the Gaza strip, and drafted a letter that would change they way Israelis conceive the military control of the occupied territories. This document came to be known as the Combatant's Letter. Combatants Letter'

This letter is as follows from soldiers in the Israeli army:

'We, reserve combat officers and soldiers of the Israel Defense Forces, who were raised upon the principles of Zionism, self-sacrifice and giving to the people of Israel and to the State of Israel, who have always served in the front lines, and who were the first to carry out any mission in order to protect the State of Israel and strengthen it.

We, combat officers and soldiers who have served the State of Israel for long weeks every year, in spite of the dear cost to our personal lives, have been on reserve duty in the Occupied Territories, and were issued commands and directives that had nothing to do with the security of our country, and that had the sole purpose of perpetuating our control over the Palestinian people.

We, whose eyes have seen the bloody toll this Occupation exacts from both sides,

We, who sensed how the commands issued to us in the Occupied Territories destroy all the values that we were raised upon,

We, who understand now that the price of Occupation is the loss of IDF’s human character and the corruption of the entire Israeli society,

We, who know that the Territories are not a part of Israel, and that all settlements are bound to be evacuated,

We hereby declare that we shall not continue to fight this War of the Settlements.

We shall not continue to fight beyond the 1967 borders in order to dominate, expel, starve and humiliate an entire people.

We hereby declare that we shall continue serving the Israel Defense Force in any mission that serves Israel’s defense.

The missions of occupation and oppression do not serve this purpose – and we shall take no part in them'.

How about:
http://www.jewishvoiceforpeace.org/publ ... gaza.shtml

"'Lights out in Gaza, News Blackout in the US'

You wouldn't know it from following the mainstream media,or from listening to any of the US presidential candidates, but some 1.5 million Palestinians are being slowly starved to death, right now, in Gaza. They have been barred from getting the food, fuel, and medical supplies they need to survive. Eighty percent of the population is dependent on food aid.

What's more, the Israeli government claims this collective punishment will protect the people of Sderot, Israel who have suffered tremendously from unrelenting rocket attacks from Gazan militants. But the Gaza blockade, and Israel's ongoing restrictions of goods and free movement, home demolitions, and use of excessive force, including dropping bombs on the heads of civilians, has only caused further loss of both Palestinian and Israeli life. Since 2000, almost 3,000 Gazans and 12 residents of Sderot have died. There is a better way to bring peace, security and justice to both peoples.

You probably also won't read in the US media that

the US actually helped foment the civil war in Gaza

Israel never ended its occupation of Gaza

or that this is all made possible through American support, and can therefore be prevented."

Nothing is more inspiring than this:

http://www.icahd.org/eng/

The Israeli Committee Against House Demolitions
ICAHD is a non-violent, direct-action group originally established to oppose and resist Israeli demolition of Palestinian homes in the Occupied Territories

'ICAHD's projects are designed to engage the Israeli and international public with the issues of occupation and the path to peace. Through a combination of grassroots political activity, people-to-people programs and informational campaigns, we are able to influence public policy.

House Rebuilding
As a direct-action group, we resist the demolition of Palestinian homes, but when they are demolished we rebuild them as an act of resistance and solidarity."

The English have a state, the Americans have a state, Israel have a state. Why cant the Palestinians have a state?

Nothing more sad than people who believe in a "Jesus Bloodline" fantasy and then get involved in stage-managed recent tombs in the south of France.

Heap of hysterical hooey.

Children and pregnant women get killed in all wars.

GET REAL.

Is the blood of an Israeli child worth less than the blood of a Palestinian child? Or a Thai child? Or a Kashmiri child? Or a Patun? Or a Dutch or Swede?

Where ever in the world Muslims live similar issues are stirred up again and again. It appears where ever they go, eventually they will create these same problems. No other race=religion or ethnic group in the world has had such problems getting along with others.

OCCUPATION? Or Disputed Territory?
The Government of Israel in its public statements and many of Israel's citizens and supporters dispute that the territories are occupied and claim that use of the term "occupied" in relation to Israel's control of the areas has no basis in international law or history, and that it prejudges the outcome of any future or ongoing negotiations. They argue it is more accurate to refer to the territories as "disputed" rather than "occupied" although they agree to apply the humanitarian provisions of the Fourth Geneva Convention pending resolution of the dispute. Nevertheless, some Israeli government websites do refer to the areas as being "occupied territories".[12]

However, in recent decades the government of Israel has argued before the Supreme Court of Israel that its authority in the territories is based on the international law of "belligerent occupation", in particular the Hague Conventions. The court has confirmed this interpretation many times, for example in its 2004 and 2005 rulings on the separation fence. [13][14] According to the BBC, "Israel argues that the international conventions relating to occupied land do not apply to the Palestinian territories because they were not under the legitimate sovereignty of any state in the first place."[15]

Soon after the 1967 war, Israel issued a military order stating that the Geneva Conventions applied to the recently-occupied territories

Where ever in the world Muslims live similar issues are stirred up again and again. It appears where ever they go, eventually they will create these same problems. No other race=religion or ethnic group in the world has had such problems getting along with others


Where ever in the world Muslims live similar issues are stirred up again and again

What has this got to do with anything? Especially the current Gaza conflict? Apart from the fact that it isnt true. And the fundamentalist aspects of Islam, are the same as fundamentalist religious people of all persuasions. Why does the world demonise Islam?

These arguments of yours have nothing to do with the current war in Gaza. You are not thinking about the Palestinian people at all. To you, they are a non - entity, they are not worthy of any respect. There is no admission by you at all regarding the suffering of the Palestinians.

No other race=religion or ethnic group in the world has had such problems getting along with others

I respectfully suggest you look up Christian history and domination! All religions have massacred others, thinking their *God* is the right God.

In fact, heres a modern poet for you, talking about those who fight with *god on their side*

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=BmDVyBceEv4

The Government of Israel in its public statements and many of Israel's citizens and supporters dispute that the territories are occupied - in recent decades the government of Israel has argued before the Supreme Court of Israel that its authority in the territories is based on the international law of "belligerent occupation", in particular the Hague Conventions. - Israel argues that the international conventions relating to occupied land do not apply to the Palestinian territories "

Does it not strike you that its just Israel complaining that where the land they have 'invaded' - it shouldnt be called an 'occupation'? The rest of the world, the UN, say its wrong, illegal.

But of course, Israel WOULD say what its saying wouldnt it? Isnt it obvious their PR machine will try and sanitize events in the Middle East, so you think that the 'hateful Palestinians' are the aggressors. I urge you from the bottom of my heart to wake up.

And anyway, your whole argument falls down, when Jewish people themsleves say its an 'occupation'. And the Israeli Army at that.

Actually, now i am trying to see how your posts on this matter equate with your signature. You know? The one about being the soul of the place where-ever you stand? The poet Rumi? A 13th-century Persian poet, Sunni Islamic jurist, and theologian....
Is he a rabid Islamist? Do you think he would support your views?

If people actually really thought Rumi a guiding light, perhaps they would take note of his other words:

"I searched for God among the Christians and on the Cross and therein I found Him not.
I went into the ancient temples of idolatry; no trace of Him was there.
I entered the mountain cave of Hira and then went as far as Qandhar but God I found not.
With set purpose I fared to the summit of Mount Caucasus and found there only 'anqa's habitation.
Then I directed my search to the Kaaba, the resort of old and young; God was not there even.
Turning to philosophy I inquired about him from ibn Sina but found Him not within his range.
I fared then to the scene of the Prophet's experience of a great divine manifestation only a "two bow-lengths' distance from him" but God was not there even in that exalted court.
Finally, I looked into my own heart and there I saw Him; He was nowhere else.

If everyone looked into their hearts - one would see the Israeli military dictatorship of the ethnic cleansing they are trying to carry out .... which is the whole point i was trying to make is immoral - its immoral what Israel is doing ....

For the last time: watch this film:

http://video.google.com:80/videoplay?do ... 8578139565

This shows it as it is. If you watch that, and still hold the views you have now ..... well .... its why there will never be peace .......

Boring!

Right my dears....hold it right there.

We will have to agree/disagree before this thread degenerates into something we will all regret later.

Let's just hope & aim for a peaceful solution for all concerned. There is no point in this excellent forum coming to typewritten blows......okay?

Peace, Love & Light to you all on this thread, 'specially Sandy n' Shasta.

bergeredearcadie said:



Sorry, but on the issue of Palestine I stand firm. The back story is extremely complex...for example everytime Jews have given in to Arab demands, even an inch, then Arabs try to grab a mile.

The Gaza green houses are perhaps the most telling symbol of the fiasco that Gaza has become, followed in short order by the Hamas -Nazi inspired declarations against all Jews worldwide, not just those they blame for everything in Israel.

For example, the recent greenhouses transfers from Isreal to Palestinians, they were a symbol of ingenuity and hope for the future of Gaza. They produced flowers, fruits and vegetables out of season and sold them for export in Europe. They were a source of employment for local Palestinians.

In August of 2005 a consortium of Jewish philanthropists mobilized to save the green houses for the Palestinians by buying them for a cost of 14 million dollars and giving them to the Palestinian authority to help the Palestinians keep their jobs and earn a living.This got US Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice’s support.
Within two days of giving this very expensive gift to the Palestinian people, Palestinians looted and destroyed the greenhouses, walking off with irrigation hoses, water pumps and plastic sheeting, even the planting varieties and scheduals, the buyers who were contracted to purchase the produce, everything the Palestinians needed to make millions for themselves, all destroyed within 24 hours and even the police had joined in the destruction, just as they had at the tomb of Jospeh the Patriarch. This was just one (of many) blows to efforts to reconstruct the Gaza Strip for the Palestinians..
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In October of 2000, within hours of giving custody of Jews holiest sites to the so-called "Palestinian authority" police, as part of giving them self-governance and control over "Palestinian territories", Arabs (Palestinians) destroyed the 3,000 year old Tomb of Joseph (remember the Biblical story of his coat of many colors?) in Shechem (Nablus) and afterwards tried to convert it into a mosque.

Joseph's Tomb was reduced to a smoldering heap of rubble. Within two days the dome of the tomb was painted green and bulldozers were seen clearing the surrounding area as the Palestinian Arabs sought to transform the biblical Joseph's resting place into a Moslem holy site.

On April 2, 2002 armed Palestinian Arab terrorists forced their way into the Church of the Nativity in Bethlehem, one of Christianity's most sacred sites, the birthplace of Christ. In the midst of over 200 nuns and priests, they remained holed up for 38 days, peeing on the alter and tearing up Bibles and Holy Books to use as toilet paper.


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This is the same pattern of destruction carried on when ever Arabs-Muslims have a chance....now consider this carefully: most all the holiest sites of Judaism and Christianity are located where Arabs want to take control of them and destroy them, that is all of Palestine and most of the Holy Land.

The birth of Jesus and the crucifixion of Jesus happened in areas that Islam "claim" is theirs...and they have NO intention of keeping these sites available for others to honor and worship, not once they have control.....nothing will be tolerated except Islam. Once they got control of the tomb (actually the cave, the building was erected over it at a later time) of Abraham and Sarah, Jews were and still are forbidden to enter.
The Dome of the Rock is another example where all other religions are kept out (more about that below).

To believe this wont continue is to be very naive. What the Jews are doing is protecting the holiest sites of their faith and the faith of all Christians. At current count, that is one third of the entire world population who are at risk to lose all their holiest sites to vandalism, destruction, and complete intolerance for others..
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Here's some more examples:

Ayatollah Sadegh Khalkhali oversaw the destruction by dynamite of the mausoleum of Reza Pahlavi (Persian) because he was of different faith.
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St. Sophia Cathedral, the Hagia Sophia (Άγια Σοφία in Greek), the Church of Holy Wisdom, known variously as Sancta Sophia in Latin or Ayasofya in Turkish, is an ancient cathedral of the Church of Constantinople located in modern-day Istanbul, Turkey. It was converted to a mosque by the Turks
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St. Nicholas Cathedral
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Umayyad caliph Abd al-Malik took the church of St. John from the Christians and had it rebuilt as a mosque, which is now known as Umayyad Mosque
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The Al Aqsa mosque (Jerusalem/Israel) was build on the roof of the Christian St. Mary basilica on the Temple Mount where previously the Jewish Temple stood.
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The Buddhas of Bamiyan were intentionally dynamited and destroyed in 2001 by the Taliban, on orders from leader Mullah Mohammed Omar.The two most prominent statues were the giant, standing Buddhas Vairocana and Sakyamuni, measuring 55 and 37 metres (180 and 121 feet) high respectively, the largest examples of standing Buddha carvings in the world. They were perhaps the most famous cultural landmarks of the region and the site was listed by UNESCO as a World Heritage Site along with the surrounding cultural landscape and archaeological remains of the Bamyan Valley. The statues represented the immense architectural skill of the Indian civilization as well as the promotion of such arts before being destroyed by Islamic forces.
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The Ram Janmabhumi temple at Ayodhya is just one of the Hindu temples among thousands of others which were converted to Islamic structures by Muslims.
It is now generally agreed by historians that the famous Taj Mahal, a Moghul structure, was built to eradicate a Hindu temple that was several thousand years old on the site.
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The Buddhist communities of Bangladesh are under pressure from the Islamic military and police not to practice Buddhism, and Buddhists have suffered abuse, arrest, and even rapes. The government encourages Muslim settlement in Buddhist areas, as part of its campaign to promote Islam. According to Jumma exiles, torture and murder of Buddhists is a frequent occurrence.
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The famous Sphynx of Egypt, together with virtually all mummies and statues of Egpyt, have their faces hacked off because Islam decrees that no human features can be made in any shape or form.
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I am not trying to sound melodramatic and I certainly do care that a child is hurt whether Palestinian, Jewish, Buddhist or Christian. I have been in several refugee camps in Afghanistan and North Africa., The suffering and poverty is appaulling and beyond average comprehension.

But I will not and can not support anything Islamic because it it counterproductive to all that the rest of humaity holds dear, especially life and limb of innocent children on all sides...

Shasta

Norton, here's a little news item to rattle all common sense I'm slipping into the thread about UFO's in the Bible:

January 3, 2009
Muslim preacher commands followers to convert aliens to Islam

Absurd, you say? Not really. The sheikh in question (Omar Bakri) probably had the Jinn in mind. Consider: 1) The Jinn (or "Genies") are inhabitants of other worlds, specifically, Alam al-Malakut, or the immaterial, "ether" worlds, and so, in modern parlance, can be seen as "aliens" living in "other worlds"; 2) Muhammad was sent as a "messenger" to both humans and Jinn (Koran 51:55-56); 3) Some Jinn do "convert" to Islam (Koran 72: 1-2).

Perhaps you think the realm of "Jinn studies" interests only, say, Sufis, or "abstract-thinking" Muslims? In fact, one of the greatest representatives of jihad against infidels, the Hanbali Sheikh of Islam, Ibn Taymiyya (c.1300s), who is still quoted regularly by modern-day jihadists, wrote an entire treatise dealing with the Jinn ("The Difference between the Allies of the Merciful and the Allies of Satan"), demonstrating that the question of the Jinn is indeed relevant to Islam.

"Hate preacher Omar Bakri instructs followers to convert aliens to Islam," (from the Daily Mail) January 3:

Exiled hate preacher Omar Bakri has ordered his followers to convert aliens to Islam.

The extraordinary instruction was issued during a bizarre rant posted on an extremist website.

The Syrian-born imam, who is notorious for praising the 9/11 bombers, told Muslims to not only spread the religion across the world, but across the galaxy. He said: 'We are obliged as Muslims to make the whole galaxy subservient to almighty Allah.

'Allah has created all living beings to obey him and worship him.'

A security source is reported to have said: 'Perhaps he could show his people the way - it would give everyone a break if he was beamed up.'

The fatwah, which appeared on an extremist website, comes after Bakri claimed he had recently been stopped from using the internet to preach to followers in the UK.


Since one of Islam's standard methods of converting others is to wage jihad against them, apparently it was only a matter of time before Holy War was declared against the infidel Jinn of the universe -- and whatever other "aliens" may be out there.

To me a UFO is anything in the air, flying around and is un-identified. It could be a weather balloon caught in the jet stream and blown out of its intended position. It could be a plane about to crash.

It could be a group of kids who set off a home-made rocket, the sort I watched as a kid standing on the Atlantic shore 200 miles south of Cape Canaveral . The govt shot off a helluva a lot of stuff from that area that was of a military nature.

We saw pilotless drones sent up by the Navy to be shot down by those missles, etc, so it all depends upon many factors, no? To blanket say there ain't no such thing as a UFO as that imbecile palsy does and attribute it to con-spiracy theory illustrates how much of a cretin he is. When artists in any age saw anything unusual and decided to paint it, this don't automagically say there was or was not something in the air at that specific moment.

Since all artists earn a living by pandering to their patrons, these patrons always have the final say, no? Just look at the modifications Sauniere wanted on the art work in his Church. He sometimes could get custom made art work, at other times it was factory produces and had to be altered, no? So what's the big deal in looking at a piece of art and not agreeing with a stranger standing next to ya.

I ran into this conundrum while I was in college when art history professors described art work in pontificating tones. I raised my hand and asked the professsor, did the artist or his patron tell that to ya while that work was under construction. Since its obvious its all conjecture I asked the Professor why was the University wasting its money on his salary when we can make up our own mind as to what we beheld.

Palsy insists in being the pontificator even tho' he is a satanist by my reckoning. Its this incongruent mixing of clashing belief systems in his approach which makes anything he sez irrelevant. He has yet to figure how to shit or get off the pot, both decisions are a dilemna to him as seen by his irrational retorts to concepts under discussion.

I use the metaphor, consider the source, any time palsy sez anything 'cuz inevitably he is confabulating in most instances. Now we have a interesting but extremely off-topic tangent about the wiles of war. 2 sides hell bent on antagonizing each other. 1 group are actual semites who date their roots to Ishmael, the other group are Talmudist-zionist who trace their roots to Khazaria in Russia, and are not semitic at all.

Both are fighting what are called proxy wars controlled by outside the arena players who supply all the war toys. Israel gets its entire armament paid for by U.S taxpayers. Palestinians get their war toys from diverse Sunni + Shia backers in oil producing countries like Libya, Saudi arabia, Iran, etc. What is interesting is that Arab war toys are almost exclusively Russian products, so boys + girls can ya figure out who is fighting who by proxy?

The sad part is, the unarmed civilian populace is the group with the most casualties. Just look at the situation in Iraq where U.S war toys are meeting resistance from Russian war toys, the same holds for the Afghan situation no? Now Pakistan is getting hit so that they will start shooting, the big question is, who gets U.S war toys to play with, who gets Russian war toys to play with?

To get involved in counting angels sitting on the tip of a needle as the threads have been doing, ya miss the scope of who benefits + why. Maybe the appearance of Mahdi in the Muslim arena will help, 'cuz he relies on Jesus (Issa) to destroy Djinn (AntiChrist to Muslims).

jake