Arcadia Discussion Zone

The cult of the dead is a very complicated area of research but fascinating none the less. The penitents celebrated the cult in subterranean crypts or necropolis under churches or cemeteries………
In the book City of Secrets (yes I am obsessed), Lucia talks about a time when she and Jose were children playing in the French woman’s garden and could often hear noises/chanting coming from below there feet. Patrice also mentions the tunnels running through the garden and down to the old cemetery that she saw when they dug up the “sun stone”.......the old Jewish cemetery was visible from the tower in those days and is now a modern housing estate. I also recall her mentioning something about the water fountain in the garden being an opening to the underworld (or words to that affect) The French woman’s house and garden were literally next door to the cathedral albeit at the back and out of sight.
La Sang/sanch is very prominent in Girona and obviously has been for generations.

It is now pretty obvious that Saunier was a member of a penitent fraternity judging by the signs he left in and around his church and therefore the story of his visits to Girona just might “Might” be true.

This has obvious links to Sauniere with the stories of him reporting the firemen for accessing water from his pump and also hanging stones he brought back from his walks over the water storage. Of course these links rely on the Sauniere stories being accurate and Patrice Chaplin not just making it all up!
Regards
Nic

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I invested in really good French to English dictionary ……
Its not just the language barrier that is the problem though, its all of the gobildy gook you have to read through before you find what you are looking for and that takes so much time, for instance I didn’t have a clue what words like Apocryphal and Manichaeism and Chaldean etc meant so I had to learn all that stuff first and then you have the simple words like Heresy that take on a whole new meaning once you understand what it actually means.
Anyway…….what I am trying to say is the more I learn the more I want to learn and that is good but understanding it all is another matter altogether.
While I was researching the word Hagiography (see what I mean?) I came across an article about a “John of Tynemouth” who died in 1366 and that got me started on a whole different track because Tynemouth Priory is my neck of the woods, it made me ashamed to realise how little I know of my own history…… .I can literally fall out of bed into Segedunum Roman Fort which is at the very end of Hadrians Wall (Wallsend) where I live and yet i know so little about it.....shamefull to say the least but something i intend to rectify now i know how to.

As a pensioner I do little odd jobs here + there to supplement my meager pittance for existence. Lately I have been giving beginner English classes, 1.5 hours once a week to Hungarian pensioners living here in Sweden. I find Hungarian interesting 'cuz ya speak it as ya read it, letter sound for letter sound, just the way Germans do.

So how come the French can't do likewise? French is not a language its a disease! There are not 'nuff letters in the French alphabet, just like in English to match the sounds they make, 'cuz William the Conqueror did a real job on Anglo-Saxon, and the UK paid the price for it ever since.

English makes do with 26 letters for 45 unique phoneme sounds. Guess what, I asked several Swedish University Professors how many unique phonemes are in Swedish and nobody knows 'cuz of this bastardized French influence. The Icelandics know 'cuz they haven't been inflicted with this nasty French disease.

The problem arose when a French general took over the Swedish throne and this blending of Swedish-French with an unusual intonation a Frenchman would deny is French but a Swede knows comes only from French.

Point I make is, French is a nowhere language going nowhere except into obsolescence due to its archaic structure. Its not all that Latin, all that Celtic, Frank-Germanic, Hun-remnant, Afro-Berber so what is it that gives French this weírd honking, snorting, whining sound pattern, no other language is afflicted with.

How many ways to spell the phoneme- O- or any other vowel for that matter. The regional differences in pronunciation of French, plus all the patois around the world makes modern French more of a nuisance. Why not introduce Esperanto with only 16 grammatical rules with no exceptions, all words ending with a vowel fall into a definitive class, like noun, verb, adjective, so there is no spelling hassles to contend with.

The intrusion of French into every language it comes in contact with has caused no end of grief. To my way of thinking it truly lives up to being the Mark of Cain, and you expect me at age 67 to torture myself? I ain't into sado-masochism dude, I do see a future for Esperanto due to its logical structure. The vocabulary of Esperanto is far greater than French 'cuz it ain't saddled with a paranoid Orwellian system of language purist guardians like they have here in Sweden, thanks to this pernicious French assault of the Swedish language.

Since the French have a plethora of their own natives websites doing their own RLC mojo, use of French on a Anglo forum is counter productive, just like using English would be on a French forum, no? By the way Roger, how many French Ben's are there? how come none of them 'frog' dudes come up with anything notable? like he did?

Why toot a French horn when an English horn is more discernible? If ya really read closely what I ask ya, it boils down to being focused + concrete. I give Roscoe + JB credit for attempting to do that, even if they are approaching the RLC enigma from their own galaxy.

jake

I recently came accross a painting by a Catalan artist called Ramon Casas in a book i am reading about Barcelona.
The painting is called Garrote Vil and i dont know how to paste it onto here but if you do a google search you will see it.
It is a very disturbing painting (at least i think so) and has quite a few La Sanch/Sang components. I didnt realise that up until the 1970,s they were still garrotting people in Spain.

Francisco Franco was fond of this terror until his demise in the 70's.

Garrote Vil: (Vile Stick)

http://usuarios.lycos.es/ramoncasas/obra/pintura/garrotevil_es.htm

"Cathars"

"In this 15th-century depiction of an (inaccurate) burning of Albigensians after an auto de fe, the condemned had been garrotted previously"

http://www.artrenewal.org/asp/database/image.asp?id=21599

thanks for posting the link for me........i might figure it out myself one day

Hi Roger
The painting is really depressing ....horrible,(not something i would like hanging on my walls)
what do you mean by coincidences????
i am not having much luck in researching la Sang really and still havent been able to get the book "The Rise" yet. I ordered it on Amazon a while ago and my brother in law is in America today and he has tried a few shops that are all sold out.......it must be doing well in America.

Hi Tingra.

On the far upper right of the message box you'll see a button named "URL"

Clicking on that will place [url] on a new line where you would then past a link directly after. Check it with "preview" at the bottom to see if it comes in as blue text as sometimes they take a couple tries to go through. Normally another [url] should be added automatically after your link but not always, at least on my end here.

When very young I watched a B- grade horror movie concerning a galleon of La Sang trapped in the Sargasso Sea who captured passing travelers for horrific penitence. The torture scenes were way over the top for a little kid and gave me nightmares.

TCJ, thanks for that, i will save it in case i come accross anything else.

The funny thing is, i have searched for La Sang stuff for ages without any luck and came accross this painting by chance today in a second hand book i was flicking through at work......the book is quite old and tells the story of the growth of Barcelona the mediterranean metropolis, in relation to Catalunya to the rest of Spain and Europe and America for over 1500 years......once i started reading it i couldnt put it down .

I was just now idly searching for that horror film on youtube and came across official La Sang processional videos they've uploaded that took me to their web page:

http://www.lasang.com/

Babelfish.org will translate into English, readability wise at least, by pasting the url into 'translate a webpage'.

"History of the brotherhood"

"Peculiarly we must emphasize, that the image of the Crucified one is accompanied by the image of Maria Magdalena who embraces the foot de la Cruz, processional mystery that dates from the last decade of century XVII."

"The figure of the Christ of little more of a meter of stop, has very well distributed proportions, of flagellated backs and head very fallen, definitively was dead. The figure of Maria Magdalena, we found semisitting on the rocks that support to the cross and with its arms it embraces to the same, giving a great sensation of agony and distresses."

Edit:
A processional video of this statue will be found linked to on my next post.

That I can well understand!

The first video of theirs has a feeling of dreary militancy throughout it, for myself, but culminates with the quite an interesting scene.

http://www.lasang.com/pa/videos.html

...

Very disturbing for me also. Historically wise, in this regions religious experience the bloodletting and horror runs rampant and I've had to turned from some aspects away to regroup many times.

The processional scenes with statuary exulting MM are very interesting however.

I am an avid reader and just love books; I really can not walk past a book shop without going in for a browse and suffice to say I have a very varied book collection.
When I read City of Secrets I was struck by the inconsistencies in the book more than anything else and it was trying to understand what it all meant that got me hooked.
I love Girona, and I read the book in the French womans garden, so the atmosphere and surroundings made it all the more poignant. Because La Sanch/sang is not easy to research I focused on the penitent movements that I could research and when you read about those you realise what a depraved world we live in, everything regarding religion throughout the ages that I have read about lately has nothing to do with doing good or loving thy neighbour blah blah blah…..it has really opened my eyes I can tell you that.
I have seen those videos before on you tube and to be honest those processions are just for the tourists and are not really real, for instance if you look at Andys Questing in Girona article, there is a photograph taken in a church of La Sanch regalia….that regalia isn’t shown on any of the processions I have seen so when do they use it? The real La Sanch is still alive in Girona and Perpignan and is a secret society and I assume that the only way to investigate it would be to join it. That painting is disturbing though and I would go as far as to say its evil.

Yes the videos were disappointing in looking like small events filled with very young processioners and gawking tourists with cameras.

Their web page won't show many revelations but having an interest in art I found the statues worthy of looking more into.

Religion can be hazardous to your health, don't get me started please.

Oh well, mostly chit-chat rubbish here on my part. It's a worthy thread better than much larger heaps of refuse too many others are turning into.

so, i am not the only one that feels 'evil' exists? and that this world is its playground?

all of me,
paula

My own personal beliefs have execution to be evil in it's essence and to the core. This was derived not from reading a newspaper or watching television but from living quite adjacent to a town in the States where this is carried out and with renown regularity and by speaking to some who worked in the system where this happened, neighbors some, others chance meetings. There was one who seriously fears for his soul having had participated. Add to this the many proven mistakes discovered that occurred after false witnesses recanting in guilt or innocence proving DNA evidence of those murdered wrongly and it just goes against all morality imo.

I've always sided with the clergymen and nuns in the candle light protest vigils for every event if only in spirit and found speaking on this to locals had me become a pariah to many of the devout "christians" that would even cheer some events on in person.

I will in fact judge a new friendship or relative very harshly when their views on this topic oppose mine.

Roger,

I witnessed the fireworks displays when Bundy was executed. Compassion for him was hard pressd to find without deep inward searching and study but the event was near literally nauseous like the art work linked here.

Ok, I'm off the negative for now..apologizes to all

or any form of empathic or loving thought...

all of me

SO….now you have seen the painting and the you tube videos…..do you think La Sanch is good or bad????
Bearing in mind that the fraternity was started to assist those that were condemned to death and is supposed to commemorate the passion and pain of Christ.
The church do take part but it is not organised by the church, it is organised by the brotherhood of “ the very precious blood of our lord jesus Christ” Vincent Ferrer who taught in Barcelona/Catalunya started the fraternity.
why is this "society" so secret?
why do they worship(for want of a better word) underground?
what do they hide or hold?

I read about the Lliria processions and they all look the same as the La Sanch ones........all very macabre. A friend of mine who lives in Valencia saw one once and said it felt evil and like watching the Klu Klux Klan and as they were carrying huge wooden crosses she expected them to burn them at the end of the spectacle.
What gets me is, why are all of these things done with the churches blessing? even if the traditional ones are only for show it still doesnt feel right somehow. I was going to ask you to elaborate on your earlier post about the funeral rights you mentioned but to be honest i really dont want to know........its all a bit too sick for me now and the more i learn the worse it gets.