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 Post subject: Re: Our Lady of La Salette...
PostPosted: 20 Sep 2009 3:37 pm 
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High King

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Paula, marian apparitions play a huge part in the Saunnier story. City of Secrets alludes to the secret society using some kind of ancient ritual to conjur up apparitions and IF our priest ever did go to Girona i would bet it had something to do with that aspect. Marion apparitions are big buisness and can transform a village, town or local priests income by millions.....whether they are true apparitions (which i doubt) or manufactured, either way the outcome is the same to the believers and have the same impact as the trade in relics had centuries ago.

i wouldnt be suprised if La Sanch or La Sang are involved in some kind of necromancy :wink:


Last edited by tingra on 20 Sep 2009 4:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Our Lady of La Salette...
PostPosted: 20 Sep 2009 3:47 pm 
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High King

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seeker wrote...

I think one non-controversial fact agreed upon about Sauniere is he was interested in the French Marian apparitions, and was a Sacred Heart devotee, that in turn being inspired by an apparition of the BVM to Mary-Margaret Alacoque at Paray-le-Monial in the 1600s (also the HQ of the Hieron du Val d'Or).


And wasnt Margaret Alacoque or more precisely the person that wrote her life story Jean joseph languet de gergy mentioned in the Serpent Rouge???


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 Post subject: Re: Our Lady of La Salette...
PostPosted: 20 Sep 2009 4:18 pm 
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Eginolf wrote:
crimson_dove wrote:
western alps?

Please consider. The Alps don't only exist in France. They also cover Switzerland, Italy, Germany (very small part) and Austria. Their eastern end is about 100 km south-west of Vienna and their western end is about 100 km north of Marseille. What did you do at school? :|


apparently not geography :-(
sorry seeker...

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 Post subject: Re: Our Lady of La Salette...
PostPosted: 20 Sep 2009 4:26 pm 
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tingra wrote:
Paula, marian apparitions play a huge part in the Saunnier story. City of Secrets alludes to the secret society using some kind of ancient ritual to conjur up apparitions and IF our priest ever did go to Girona i would bet it had something to do with that aspect. Marion apparitions are big buisness and can transform a village, town or local priests income by millions.....whether they are true apparitions (which i doubt) or manufactured, either way the outcome is the same to the believers and have the same impact as the trade in relics had centuries ago.

i wouldnt be suprised if La Sanch or La Sang are involved in some kind of necromancy :wink:


i wouldn't be surprised either.
i have been researching necromancy and it is disturbing.
imho

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 Post subject: Re: Our Lady of La Salette...
PostPosted: 20 Sep 2009 8:29 pm 
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Simply put. as i have tried to say before. so take it or leave it...so called "Marial" apparitions are side effects of a certain ritual connected to the use of the "Crista"....check out the dates....and personally...there's nothing "Marial" about them.


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 Post subject: Re: Our Lady of La Salette...
PostPosted: 21 Sep 2009 12:05 am 
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tingra wrote:
And wasnt Margaret Alacoque or more precisely the person that wrote her life story Jean joseph languet de gergy mentioned in the Serpent Rouge???


I'm sorry ... where was he mentioned in LSR?

But yes, he wrote her bio...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean-Josep ... t_de_Gergy

Son of the public prosecutor of the parlement of Bourgogne, Languet de Gercy and was a protégé of Jacques Bénigne Bossuet, who introduced him to Louis XIV and had him named as the chaplain to the princess. At the same time he was the general vicar of the diocese of Autun, which includes the parish of Paray-le-Monial where the saint Marguerite Marie Alacoque is buried. Ordered to investigate the miracles that were said to have occurred at her hand, he wrote a biography of Alacoque in 1729. Furthermore, he was named bishop of Soissons in 1715, and elected member of l'Académie française in 1721. He was also named archbishop of Sens in 1730 and the Conseil d'État (Council of State) in 1747.

Languet de Gergy's work on the life of Alacoque was violently attacked by the Jansenites opposed to the catholic devotion of the Sacred Heart. Also defender of the papal bull Unigenitus, he was meddled in numerous political-religious controversies, and was equally known for both the content of his pamphlets, and their number. He belong to the parti des dévots opposed to the philosophies of the Age of Enlightenment and fought fiercely against the candidacies of Montesquieu and Voltaire to l'Académie française.

[snip]

We definitely know one place Sauniere sent some of his money, even if we don't know where it all came from ...

The Basilica of the Sacred Heart
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basilique_du_Sacré-Cœur,_Paris

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 Post subject: Re: Our Lady of La Salette...
PostPosted: 21 Sep 2009 12:07 am 
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Sheila wrote:
Simply put. as i have tried to say before. so take it or leave it...so called "Marial" apparitions are side effects of a certain ritual connected to the use of the "Crista"....check out the dates....and personally...there's nothing "Marial" about them.


I'm afraid I do not understand this connection at all, so please explain it.

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 Post subject: Re: Our Lady of La Salette...
PostPosted: 21 Sep 2009 3:00 am 
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High King
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Seeker1 wrote:
Sheila wrote:
Simply put. as i have tried to say before. so take it or leave it...so called "Marial" apparitions are side effects of a certain ritual connected to the use of the "Crista"....check out the dates....and personally...there's nothing "Marial" about them.


I'm afraid I do not understand this connection at all, so please explain it.

You'll have to wait until Isaac's book is printed. IF that will be printed ever. It doesn't look like. :mrgreen:


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 Post subject: Re: Our Lady of La Salette...
PostPosted: 21 Sep 2009 6:41 am 
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High King

Joined: 15 May 2008 7:42 pm
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Location: NEWCASTLE on the Tyne
Seeker1 wrote:
tingra wrote:
And wasnt Margaret Alacoque or more precisely the person that wrote her life story Jean joseph languet de gergy mentioned in the Serpent Rouge???


I'm sorry ... where was he mentioned in LSR?

But yes, he wrote her bio...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean-Josep ... t_de_Gergy

Son of the public prosecutor of the parlement of Bourgogne, Languet de Gercy and was a protégé of Jacques Bénigne Bossuet, who introduced him to Louis XIV and had him named as the chaplain to the princess. At the same time he was the general vicar of the diocese of Autun, which includes the parish of Paray-le-Monial where the saint Marguerite Marie Alacoque is buried. Ordered to investigate the miracles that were said to have occurred at her hand, he wrote a biography of Alacoque in 1729. Furthermore, he was named bishop of Soissons in 1715, and elected member of l'Académie française in 1721. He was also named archbishop of Sens in 1730 and the Conseil d'État (Council of State) in 1747.

Languet de Gergy's work on the life of Alacoque was violently attacked by the Jansenites opposed to the catholic devotion of the Sacred Heart. Also defender of the papal bull Unigenitus, he was meddled in numerous political-religious controversies, and was equally known for both the content of his pamphlets, and their number. He belong to the parti des dévots opposed to the philosophies of the Age of Enlightenment and fought fiercely against the candidacies of Montesquieu and Voltaire to l'Académie française.

[snip]

We definitely know one place Sauniere sent some of his money, even if we don't know where it all came from ...

The Basilica of the Sacred Heart
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basilique_du_Sacré-Cœur,_Paris



havent got time to check...gotta go to work but think its page 11, its a picture of his tomb etc and its with all those other important bits that everyone ignores because they focus on the poem instead :roll:


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 Post subject: Re: Our Lady of La Salette...
PostPosted: 21 Sep 2009 1:27 pm 
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Your point's taken ... obviously in most texts the text is foreground and the illustrations are background but this mystery is full of inversals ...

Probably Marcus Williamson should have included more of the illustrations and images from the source document, when he posted it and the translation online. He refers to & discusses some of the illustrations in his discussions of the notes; but might as well have just scanned and reproduced them.

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 Post subject: Re: Our Lady of La Salette...
PostPosted: 21 Sep 2009 6:50 pm 
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High King

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not a very good scan sorry.....but deffinately an interesting tomb :D


Image

Image


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 Post subject: Re: Our Lady of La Salette...
PostPosted: 21 Sep 2009 8:56 pm 
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BTW, Languet de Gercy is the one who requested construction of the St. Sulpice church "meridienne" gnomon in 1727. That could be one reason he appears in the document.

I agree the Sacred Heart connection shouldn't be overlooked, though.

Incidentally, there is one interesting discussion in HBHG that very few people dilate on very much. They suggest that St. Sulpice was actually the headquarters of the Catholic Modernist movement. Thus, far from being a center of devotion, Sulpice really was a place of challenge to orthodoxy.

It turns out this is an HBHG assertion that does check out. Sort of.

For a period of time, anyway. While under the leadership of the Abbe John Hogan, an Irishman, Sulpice promoted the scholarship of Alfred Loisy and other Parisian Modernists. Modernists also thrived at Dunwoodie, an American Sulpician center that published the modernist leaning New York Review.

However, after Hogan's departure, the conservative leadership of the Seminary of St. Sulpice reasserted itself, and cut off access to Loisy's lectures and the Dunwoodie scholars, who left the Sulpicians in protest.

Baigent continues to maintain in the Jesus Papers that Canon Alfred Lilley saw the document establishing Jesus surviving the crucifixion in 45 CE at St. Sulpice.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/12084683/page/2/

There’s been talk of treasure buried in the hills in Southern France for centuries. Year after year, people make pilgrimages here in search of fortune.

Author Michael Baigent says what drew him here were the whisperings of something far more valuable— he was looking for evidence that Jesus survived the crucifixion.

He says information about a mysterious document arrived in a letter he got his hands on 20 years ago.

[snip]

Michael Baigent, author: The letter came out of the blue. And there seemed to be some treasure associated with it.

The letter reads: “The treasure is not one of gold and precious stones, but a document containing incontrovertible evidence that Jesus was alive in the year 45 AD.”

It’s significant date because it’s more than a decade after the accepted date for the crucifixion.

Sara James, Dateline correspondent: Because if he had been alive in 45 A.D. He couldn’t have died on the cross?

Baigent: Exactly.

Baigent says that mysterious document was last seen at the Church of San Sulpice in Paris.

He believes it calls into question the accepted story about when and how Jesus died.

James: For you, San Sulpice is more than a beautiful church. You believe this is a place where clues have been found?

Baigent: Absolutely. Archaeologists were digging up material and here is where it was brought together.

And where according to Baigent, in the late 1800s, that mysterious document was seen by a prominent member of the English Church, Canon Alfred Lilley. The alleged document written supposedly indicated Jesus didn’t die on the cross. But soon after, Lilley’s document vanished, never to be seen again.

[snip]

Even Baigent admits what he says here can't be proved. Another disappeared document. The name of the Anglican writing about Lilley who contacted him though isn't found in many places but in the Jesus Papers he reveals it was the Rev. Dr. Douglas William Guest Bartlett.

Dunno if Bartlett's story is true -- or if Baigent is making some of it up -- one thing I do know for sure: Lilley was a Modernist.
http://openlibrary.org/b/OL7189603M/Modernism
http://www.st-andrews.ac.uk/specialcoll ... tMovement/

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 Post subject: Re: Our Lady of La Salette...
PostPosted: 22 Sep 2009 4:42 pm 
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Roger wrote:
Sheila wrote:
Simply put. as i have tried to say before. so take it or leave it...so called "Marial" apparitions are side effects of a certain ritual connected to the use of the "Crista"....check out the dates....and personally...there's nothing "Marial" about them.


I would concur with this, in many cases. Not all... Therein lies the great difficulty with certain situations, including the goings-on in Medjugorge (sp?)


i agree...
so, this is why i asked whether it was a bishop or the Pope himself, that declared Salette.
oh, and i found this spelling Medjugorje ;-)

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 Post subject: Re: Our Lady of La Salette...
PostPosted: 22 Sep 2009 10:40 pm 
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High King
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Roger:
Quote:
It might interest some to know that Gergy, in the Saone valley, was a Chanterac fiefdom, and a branch of the family still resides there.

And I'd add that a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, particularly when one relies entirely on prior "research" without doing one's own. Still, it seems that by simply uncritically regurgitating copious amounts of others' speculative research (including stuff to which one was made privy in private and can then be regurgitated without attribution) one can become a media pundit. Are any of you getting calls yet, for TV shows on RLC or the new Dan Beige? Hmmm?


I want to believe yr a Good Man Roger so I will.
In fact to me you are a great big cuddly teddy bear a bit gruff at times and tend towards Over Bearing but otherwise protecting your young. :lol:

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