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 Post subject: References to the Grail - Malory's Le Morte d' Arthur
PostPosted: 29 Apr 2009 2:51 pm 
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I have just recenlty finished re-reading Le Morte d' Arthur and thought it would be nice if the literary references to the Grail were referenced on this forum.

I don't think this excercise will infringe on any copyrights, as the book and author get full credit and direct quotes are in quotes. But if there is a problem, please let me know before everything gets deleted.


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PostPosted: 29 Apr 2009 2:53 pm 
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Malory’s
Le Morte d’ Arthur

The first mention of the Grail in Le Morte d’ Arthur occurs in “The Book of Sir Tristram of Lyoness, Chapter 14 “Lancelot and Elaine.”

After the feast of Whitsun, Lancelot rode out to the castle of Pointe Corbyn looking for adventure. When he reached the town, the people welcomed him as if expecting him. He was needed to free the beautiful, naked lady imprisoned in the tower that was scalded daily with hot water (Sir Gawain did not have the power to rescue her).

He succeeded in rescuing her, and was then asked by the townspeople to save them from the serpent in the tomb. The tomb was inscribed with gold letters:

HERE SHALL COM A LEOPARD OF KING’S BLOOD AND HE SHALL SLE THIS SERPENTE, AND THIS LEOPARD SHALL ENGENEDER A LYON IN THIS FORAYNE COUNTREY WHYCH LYON SHALL PASSE ALL OTHER KNYGHTES.

After a long battle with the fire breathing serpent, Lancelot wins.


Then a knight rode up to him….“Sir, I am King Pelles, a descendant of Joseph of Arimathea, and ruler of this country.”
“….When they were all seated in the hall, a small dove appeared at the window. In its beak was a gold censer from which came a most fragrant and concentrated odor of spices, and suddenly the table was laden with every conceivable variety of meat and wine. Then a young noblewoman, bearing a gold vessel in her hands, appeared, and the king knelt down before her and prayed.”

“In the name of the Lord! What does this mean?” asked Sir Lancelot.

“Sir, this is the richest gift on earth—the Holy Grail: and when it passes through King Arthur’s court the fellowship of the Round Table will be dispersed for a season, while his knights go in search of it.”


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 Post subject: personal woo...
PostPosted: 29 Apr 2009 3:06 pm 
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Camelot...

In the U.S., Camelot is associated with the Kennedy's.

This is a picture of Jackie Kennedy (didn't see any copyright problems)
Image


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 Post subject: personal woo continued....
PostPosted: 29 Apr 2009 3:10 pm 
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This is my Aunt...she was Miss Virginia 1963...her last name is now MALLORY

Image

http://www.missva.com/formermissamericacontestants.htm


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 Post subject: personal woo continued
PostPosted: 29 Apr 2009 3:16 pm 
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Notice the bolded words in the text above.....

(these are 2 different images of my father's family's coat of arms...my aunt, above, and father were not related except through marriage)

Image


Image



On the left of the shield is the snake.
On the right of the shield is the dove.
Below the shield is a chained man, Prometheus, who gave FIRE to man and saved Io.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 29 Apr 2009 3:20 pm 
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clan donnachaidh...the surnames: Robertson, Duncan, Reid

Are considered to be the Kindred of St. Columba...who lived on the island of Iona....


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PostPosted: 29 Apr 2009 3:33 pm 
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Considering the research that TCP has done...that all of us descend from kings and are only 6 degrees from one another...

I would really like to see what others have....


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 29 Apr 2009 3:38 pm 
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KWA???

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 30 Apr 2009 10:48 am 
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Roger wrote:
I hope you realise that La Morte d'Arthur is a very late remix "au gout du jour" of the original Grail stories?

As to the connection, if any between Bouviers and Mallorys, I fail to "get it".


That's okay, you're not supposed to get it.

I've got more notes on the book, but I will have to get to it later....today is going to be a really busy day...and it's not yet 7am....

Later.


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 Post subject: Well I'm a mixed bag
PostPosted: 01 May 2009 2:18 am 
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Serendipity

Im from the clan of Diarmuid Ua Duibhne and King Mongan

and Mary Queen of Scots
I'm a Stewart too
I'm French but I'm keeping that name a bit of a mystery

Lets put it this way
we were rebels
:D

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 Post subject: Re: Well I'm a mixed bag
PostPosted: 01 May 2009 12:02 pm 
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lovuian wrote:
Serendipity

Im from the clan of Diarmuid Ua Duibhne and King Mongan

and Mary Queen of Scots
I'm a Stewart too
I'm French but I'm keeping that name a bit of a mystery

Lets put it this way
we were rebels
:D


I don't know if you followed the link under my aunts picture...but that makes us cousins!

The odd thing is...my mothers family and my fathers family are/were ancient enemies...the campbells and robertsons tried to wipe each other off the map more than once....I guess that's why the marriage didn't last very long :wink:


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 Post subject: Get out of here
PostPosted: 01 May 2009 3:11 pm 
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HI COUSIN!!! :D

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 01 May 2009 5:42 pm 
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your on the wrong forum.....
this is where you should be....
http://www.friendsreunited.co.uk/


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 02 May 2009 2:16 am 
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I'm from the same clan Queen Elizabeth came from. That means I can be a royal pain. The clan part is true though. To keep this post on topic, the Holy Grail is also nifty.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 04 May 2009 10:45 am 
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ndawe wrote:
KWA???


Okay...what does that mean?

I even asked my teenager, and he didn't know.

Is the W suppose to be an M?

Then I'd understand....alittlle slow, but then again I don't text message or even own a cell phone....technology challenged and proud of it.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 04 May 2009 11:11 am 
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It means .....QUOI ?.....sounds the same when spoken, you'll need a french dictionary to find out the meaning though.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 04 May 2009 5:17 pm 
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Sheila wrote:
It means .....QUOI ?.....sounds the same when spoken, you'll need a french dictionary to find out the meaning though.


Thank you!

it means = what?

at least that's what the online dictionary said...is it correct?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 04 May 2009 6:20 pm 
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Yes, that's right - "quoi?" means "what?"...


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 Post subject: howdy cousins...
PostPosted: 11 May 2009 1:06 pm 
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Now that i made my greets as they say on da block in da 'hood I have a question for Serendipity, whose license plate does that avatar of yers belong to?

If ya go thru a random search of acronyms that MF person, are they also kin folk to ya? I ask 'cuz in the Grail legends of olde I am sure there were lots of these MF's all over the place, cutting each other's throat to be able to lay their grubby paws on what they thought was this mysterious 'Grail'.

Since DVB mentioned it may be of a more common substance, related, sort of, to the water of life...whiskey, its this MF connection ya haven't made yet.

I take it ya gotta be a dyed-in-the-wool rridge runnin' redneck rebel from Appalachia that traces its roots back to not so joly olde England where religious persecution reigned to be part of this illustrious MF clan. They made their mark early on in the colonial period makin' white lightnin' hooch, of the vilest sort.

Was that their 'grale' point? In Appalachia they still define a virgin as a gal who can out run her brother's, yes? The Hatfield + McCoys feud was due to this lethal brew of mixin' white lighnin' with fast women. Yeah, olde English traditions die hard in them thar hills.

BTW, talking about Reid...
http://briefingroom.thehill.com/2009/05 ... ngle-reid/

Its all relative, ain't it cousin?


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 Post subject: Re: howdy cousins...
PostPosted: 12 May 2009 11:25 am 
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M T GRAVES wrote:
Now that i made my greets as they say on da block in da 'hood I have a question for Serendipity, whose license plate does that avatar of yers belong to? The license plate is mine, the initials are mine. The plates were a wedding gift from my husband.

If ya go thru a random search of acronyms that MF person, are they also kin folk to ya? I ask 'cuz in the Grail legends of olde I am sure there were lots of these MF's all over the place, cutting each other's throat to be able to lay their grubby paws on what they thought was this mysterious 'Grail'. Well, that's my point isn't it? And you are correct, the family that the "F" represents fought in the Civil War and were the most decorated for that event...there were so many, from the same place, that they had their own platoon (or whatever)...they were fighting men, and still are.

Since DVB mentioned it may be of a more common substance, related, sort of, to the water of life...whiskey, its this MF connection ya haven't made yet.

I take it ya gotta be a dyed-in-the-wool rridge runnin' redneck rebel from Appalachia that traces its roots back to not so joly olde England where religious persecution reigned to be part of this illustrious MF clan. They made their mark early on in the colonial period makin' white lightnin' hooch, of the vilest sort. White lightnin' is not vile, unless you are too much of a pussy to handle 150+ proof...if made correctly, it should be as smooth as silk...last batch I had was grape...tasted just like a soda - i added soda water so it would fizz - yummy.

Was that their 'grale' point? In Appalachia they still define a virgin as a gal who can out run her brother's, yes? The Hatfield + McCoys feud was due to this lethal brew of mixin' white lighnin' with fast women. Yeah, olde English traditions die hard in them thar hills. - FAR more Scot-Irish and German than English in these hills...and if you do research into the Hatfields and McCoys you will find that the feud was begun by the Pinkertons &/or Baldwin-Felts murdering the sheriff in cold-blood...the sheriff's family got their revenge though....

http://www.bitsofnews.com/content/view/6074/
more on Rednecks...

It was the only time in American history that government airplanes intentionally bombed its own citizens. It was the largest armed insurrection fought on American soil since the Civil War.

And it has been almost totally forgotten outside of the lore of the United Mine Workers of America.

The Rise of the UMWA

"Ain't but two sides to this world. Them that work and them that don't. You work, they don't. That's all you got to know about the enemy."- character Joe Kenehan, from the movie Matewan

The UMWA was founded in Columbus, Ohio in 1890.

At the time, miners were often immigrants from central and eastern europe that didn't speak english, thus making them easy to exploit. This was reflected in the first UMWA constitution which barred discrimination based on "race, religion or national origin".

Most often miners were paid in company script that could only be used at company stores and to pay for company housing. This left them vulnerable to high monopoly prices. A miner was completely unable to save money.

Miners were only paid for tonnes of ore mined. The owners picked out the man who weighed the ore, thus leaving the miner vulnerable to being cheated. Miners weren't paid for any other necessary duty such as laying down tracks or putting in supports so the mine didn't collapse on them. The average workweek was 6 day, 10 hours a day.

Mining safety laws were either nonexistent, or simply ignored. Besides Black Lung and other occupational hazards that the mine owners ignored, mine explosions and collapses were far too common for any moral defense. Having children work in the mines was common practice.

But the most common complaint from miners was the Yellow Dog Contract that they were forced to sign when going to work. Until it was outlawed in 1932, any miner who even talked about unionizing was legally fired and blacklisted. Of course this also meant having his family kicked out of their home. Mine owners employed dozens, or even thousands of thugs (depending on the size of the company) to enforce company policy.

The suffering of America's miners was largely ignored by a country that often didn't want the immigrants anyway, and their strikes were often met with deadly violence. The Pinkerton Agency cut its teeth on murdering immigrant miners in the 1870's.

Shortly after its creation the UMWA met with its first crisis - the Lattimer Massacre.


BTW, talking about Reid...
http://briefingroom.thehill.com/2009/05 ... ngle-reid/

Its all relative, ain't it cousin? Yes it is. Up here if you can't prove you are a relative you get thrown off the mountain...for being a revenuer.


Last edited by Serendipity on 12 May 2009 11:29 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 12 May 2009 11:28 am 
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The Rednecks were Fascist fighters...we will need them again fairly shortly I'm sure.


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 Post subject: who else drank that brew + lived to talk 'boot it?
PostPosted: 12 May 2009 1:04 pm 
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I take it this hi-octane hooch is a family heirloom of sorts, if so, did folks who spun the Arthurian legend do it after seeing their 1st pink elephant? I recall being in Dahlonega, Ga as medical support for Ranger training, the locals would mosey thru our training areas with wheel barrows full of stone jugs of that ghastly brew.

The quickest way to test for purity was to burn a spoonful, if the flame wasn't consistently bright blue from start to finish, it was contaminated. Folk in them thar hills used rusty car radiators as condensers, used old T-shirts to catch the rust particles as the brew trickled thru. The raw ingredients let much to be desired, quite often stored in old, moldy grain sacks.

After this devils brew reaches 55% alcohol-110 proof it has no distinctive taste left and any contaminating chemicals unless visibly seen by the fact the liquid is not crystal clear will also not be tasted. That's why a burn test and better yet a flame spectometry is vital. Its definitely better to be a conservative whussy than to just take chances.

The Irish in Ireland know how to make poteen quite strong by double distilling it out on the bogs, that's where it gets its name bogwater tea from, but these hillbilles ain't genu-whine Irish, no suh.

But them ridge-runnin' rednecks who all proudly say they be's English, throw some Scots in, descendants, with a functional 60-70 word vocabulary Appalachia dudes I encountered the entire time I served rep'd the bottom half of the lowest common denominator, yessiree bob, they wasted every paycheck they got every month gettin' drunk. Hot dang, y'awl.

If you find more Germans + Scots-Irish in the hills yer in, ya can't be talking the same Appalachia I experienced 1st hand. It sounds more like the Alleghenies, or Blue Ridge. The Hatfields + McCoys who managed to get into the army that I met never mentioned the Pinkerton incident, but they all talked 'boot controlling the boot-leg likker biz, and impregnatin' gals from the other families, so that they wouldn't have to pull a Jerry Lee Lewis and marry a 14 y.o 1st cousin.

BTW, why would yer own hubby describe ya in such terms of endearment as 1 rotn MF, are we to take it in all of the possible meanings it conveys?


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 Post subject: Re: who else drank that brew + lived to talk 'boot it?
PostPosted: 12 May 2009 3:20 pm 
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M T GRAVES wrote:
I take it this hi-octane hooch is a family heirloom of sorts, if so, did folks who spun the Arthurian legend do it after seeing their 1st pink elephant? I recall being in Dahlonega, Ga as medical support for Ranger training, the locals would mosey thru our training areas with wheel barrows full of stone jugs of that ghastly brew. You did watch the Walton's didn't you...even they had the 'recipe.' And if you noticed, it wasn't in stone jugs it was in mason jars...so you could see any impurities...now, I didn't say that I made the stuff, but I may live fairly close to the moonshine capital of the world...and it AINT in WVA. My brother went to school in Dahlonega. The humidity is so bad there in the summer that you cannot breathe...hell on earth fer sure....

The quickest way to test for purity was to burn a spoonful, if the flame wasn't consistently bright blue from start to finish, it was contaminated. Folk in them thar hills used rusty car radiators as condensers, used old T-shirts to catch the rust particles as the brew trickled thru. The raw ingredients let much to be desired, quite often stored in old, moldy grain sacks. I suppose it is best to know who you are buying from...see up here, the people who can't prove that they are related to someone...they get the stuff stored in the moldy grain sacks and such...the good stuff is reserved for family.

After this devils brew reaches 55% alcohol-110 proof it has no distinctive taste left and any contaminating chemicals unless visibly seen by the fact the liquid is not crystal clear will also not be tasted. That's why a burn test and better yet a flame spectometry is vital. Its definitely better to be a conservative whussy than to just take chances. Man, they must have REALLY disliked you to be giving you the dregs...

The Irish in Ireland know how to make poteen quite strong by double distilling it out on the bogs, that's where it gets its name bogwater tea from, but these hillbilles ain't genu-whine Irish, no suh. So. One of the old distillories(sp) in Scotland has a recipe for whiskey so powerful they have to get a special permit to make it...and the Myans/Inca's had a recipe for beer that included chocolate...I guess we are all just a bunch of drunks.

But them ridge-runnin' rednecks who all proudly say they be's English, throw some Scots in, descendants, with a functional 60-70 word vocabulary Appalachia dudes I encountered the entire time I served rep'd the bottom half of the lowest common denominator, yessiree bob, they wasted every paycheck they got every month gettin' drunk. Hot dang, y'awl. Considering that almost every house in West VA is sitting on natural gas or coal...the guys probably didn't need the money for anything but drinking. Tell me Jake, how many times were you fired on while in the service? And then tell me how many times one of these guys saved the rear-end of someone like you? Because with these men, gun control means hitting what you aim at...you don't do much else than run your mouth...constantly criticizing and belittling people you really don't even know.

If you find more Germans + Scots-Irish in the hills yer in, ya can't be talking the same Appalachia I experienced 1st hand. It sounds more like the Alleghenies, or Blue Ridge. The Hatfields + McCoys who managed to get into the army that I met never mentioned the Pinkerton incident, but they all talked 'boot controlling the boot-leg likker biz, and impregnatin' gals from the other families, so that they wouldn't have to pull a Jerry Lee Lewis and marry a 14 y.o 1st cousin. When you were in North GA you were in the Blue Ridge Mountains...portions of which are still very thinly populated...so you have to travel to find a woman from another family...gee, guys in the military sitting around talking about women, that would be odd only to you.

BTW, why would yer own hubby describe ya in such terms of endearment as 1 rotn MF, are we to take it in all of the possible meanings it conveys?
The only possible meaning is: my first name begins with M and my last name begins with F. My husband spoils me rotten. Therefore, my royal title. It is a statement of fact.

You can poke fun at the heritage I love all you want. Personally, I am glad you do not live in the US any longer. This country is in trouble, and needs people who will support her and NOT constantly berate and belittle her. The people that you show much contempt for, I KNOW will have MY back WTSHTF....who has yours?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 12 May 2009 3:59 pm 
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Two weeks ago I drove around and looked after an elderly uncle while we spent a few days at his Chatuge Reservoir shore-side summer home.

Between tilling and planting in his large vegetable garden much time was spent in the surrounding small extreme northwestern Georgia hamlets where one even still today can hear a vernacular from the "real'" locals that remains untouched by speak from beyond those mountains. I found the heavy accents actually pleasant to listen to.

I also found that all high schools in this area graduate students with SAT and college board exams that easily rival or exceed the rest of the countries scores. This can be partly explained by their not having the ridiculous distractions of "urban" culture and the anti-education attitudes that go with it.

In further coming to those "hillbillies" defense, I experienced a gentility, honest friendliness and helpfulness that is rare is my country anymore as I find it while traveling lately, especially so in Florida where suspicion and macho posturing reign as the social norms.

To be even handed I should add that the local mountain dairy distributor there has on their milk containers a photo of a chubby cheeked glass of milk hoisting military hair-cut sporting local with an MTV clone mustache and goatee. This was quite irritating and dismaying to wake to every morning I must say.


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 Post subject: why I posted the way I did...
PostPosted: 12 May 2009 8:32 pm 
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In order to create a military macho mystique Uncle don't want choir boys he wants hell-raising rebels who thrive on this macho bullshit. The greater the danger, the more chances to bullshit 'boot it.

BTW, the dudes in 'Nam who put up the best fight were those who were drafted, not the loudmouth bullshittin' hillbillies I was stuck nursin' their lil' bob-boo's. These draftees knew they had a life to go back to, them hillbillies knew they had tobacco road to look forward to. So Uncle got stuck with them by the 1,000s. Its the only idea of home they really ever experienced, it ain't called 3 hots + a cot for nuthin', crawlin' out of their fart sack had real meanin' to these dudes.

Keep in mind I did not serve with college folk from the deep South who were enlisted, surprisingly quite a few of them became officers looking for a way to escape the drudgery of the South and hillbilly country. Since you were not part of this daily drudgery for over 20 years 'MF' you had no idea how much those officers hated being around them thar ridge-runners.

I was the only person these officers could hold an intellectual conversation with in terms of how to wean them off their drug addictions, I use plural, 'cuz ya gotta factor in other body stimulants like, caffeine in tablet form, nicotine in stick-on patch form, ya know these dudes, they stuff a wad of chaw tobaccy 'twen their lip + lower teeth, under their tongue + smoked cigarettes at the same time, the tobacco juice slobberin' over their chin when they talked. Life ain't worth livin' if ya don't wake up with a hang over, get yer daily caffeine + nicotine fix at zero dark 30 in the morning before ya head on to chow and grease down on biscuits + gravy, the gravy is 100% bacon fat with salt, pepper + some flour to thicken it up a bit, why that's good eatin' to them country dudes, a real 5-star meal, and don't forget the bleached, cracked corn meal mush they call grits totally devoid of any nutrition, all these guys stuff in their gut is hi-salt, saturated fat with a huge carbohydrate overload. yeah,... real healthy country living. For the more sophisticated 'mongst them the addition of McIlhennys cajun hot sauce slathered all over that biscuits, gravy + grits, yeah.. now that's what they really call livin' the good life.

Here's an interesting stat for ya to chaw on, the average life expectancy of an enlisted retiree after 25years duty is 8-10 years, for an officer its 15-18.
These folk are not expected to hang around the planet very long after they eat a fat + salt saturated diet of their own choosing. Its this macho bravado every army since the beginning of time depended on.

BTW, MF, if ya know somebody who lived in Dahlonega, ask them if they ever hiked the Appalachian Trail, it starts in Dahlonega. 'cuz of a small gold strike in that area a long time ago. If ya look at the sweep of the Blue Ridge that goes from Virginia to west part of Noath Kaw-lina, parallel to the Shenandoah Valley ya see it don't quite make it to Georgia, but not that far away either, in ridge runner talk of over thar yonder.

TCJ,

I gather that genteel country dude ya talked to had a decent education, held a payin' job he wasn't ashamed of, went to Church to pray + not to prey, if ya get my drift, he paid his taxes, didn't hang with tax evadin' moonshiners, he acted in a respectful manner when women were present, he was not a living example of every redneck bubba joke ya ever heard.

Yes, the countrysides of many places of the world are full of these decent, quiet, religious folk. I used the example of the rowdy redneck o exemplify the rowdy holligans ya find all over the world who never paid their momma no heed, 'cuz she could out cuss every last one of them.

I assume when MF gets a goodly amount of her beloved boot-leg hi-octane hooch in her blood stream, why, I bet she acts jest like 1 of the boys, ya know the deal, medically speaking, she suffers from too much blood in her alcohol stream and that extra oxygen kick going to her brain causes all sorts of havoc 'cuz the brain is attempting to sort out a mish-mash of conflicting biochemical signals.

Check out what symptoms alcoholics present when they exceed their blood level in their alcohol stream, it makes for very interesting reading, absinthe abuse would be a good place to start with. Since we have a real doctor on board I am sure RS can do a far better job of demonstrating the marvelous things home-brew booze can do.

Hey, MF. them moonshiners I met in Dahlonega used stone jugs and buried them in the ground so that over winter they could handle frozen ground, they knew from experience glass cracks. They didn't sell ya them stone jars, ya got a mason jar, they filled on the spot.

Yer right 'boot them moonshiners not likin' me, I told every troopie if they came in to sick call as a result of drinkin' bad hooch and had to be hospitalized, I ensured their hasty exit from the army tit they clinged to. They became civilians again. I was doin' these ignorant yay-hoo's a favor by testing that garbage before they bought it.

Ya see, my task was to conserve the fightin' strength, and if it meant to save a guys life by removin' him out of harms way meant kickin' his worthless butt out of the service I did it. Like I mentioned in another topic if ya ever get to meet Bunny make sure to say hi for me. Her hubby knows me real well.

this line really cracked me up, it demo's how lil' ya know 'boot real army life,...guys in the military sitting around talking about women, that would be odd only to you. Uh, when was the last time you were stationed in the Mannheim, Germany area? 'Cuz that's where I was for nearly 17 years on 4 duty tours. Shortage of women did ya say? Going from hilltop down into the hollers, did ya say?

How many of them jive-talking bullshittin' rednecks did I pump up with bicillin and other sundry medicinals of to get rid of the gift that keeps on giving? STDs were our biggest un-necessary money wasters. Oh how I wished I had the contract to supply the entire worldwide mil establishment with just those medicinals, its nearly a billion bux a year biz 'cuz these yay-hoo's can't keep their gun in their holster..

The ho's of Mannheim drove around in Mercedes convertibles compliments of yer fella ridge runners. In a way it serves these macho dudes right to have to be in the Mid East deserts, it gives them a chance to get rid of their drug addiction demons, booze being the nastiest drug of all.

Them dudes ya adore ain't 'zakly angels, are they, but they sho' have their demons.


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