Arcadia Discussion Zone

Saw this on the Beeb and thought you guys might find this of interest. A project is underway to extract and examine the DNA from possible remains from Bigfoot/Yeti's that have been collected from around the world over the years. Added a poll for a giggle - who believes in Bigfoot?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-18160673

I do

Thanks, Crow. I believe in Yetis, I think. Not so much Bigfoot, I know less about him, but think it would be a lot harder for him to exist undetected till now in that part of the world. But yetis, yes, I think so, probably. Much of that area is very unexplored, and truly remote, and some of the stories, about strange footsteps in the snow, and suchlike, are quite compelling. Anyway, I'd like to believe in it, so I voted for it.

If there are yetis, and they are ever found then I'd imagine they'd probably be quite bad tempered, on account of being disturbed, but one hopes that they might be like the creature portrayed in what I think is Herge's greatest ever Tintin adventure, "Tintin in Tibet", c. 1960, in which the yeti is a gentle animal who helps Tintin and his companions. The final image, of a sad and lonely yeti, watching Tintin's caravan disappear into the distance, is one that really stays with you. Wonderful book, beautifully illustrated, great story.

We call them Yowies in Australia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yowie

We even had chocolate ones with a toy inside but they are now extinct. oh well.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cadbury_Yowie

I tend to agree that it's probably more likely that a species survived in the wilds of the Himalayas than in the US, although native Amaricans do have similar folklore. Maybe the stories are just a shared memory of those who once lived alongside us, (the Neanderthals for example) way back in the past.

I like the idea of a benevolent Yeti looking out for Tintin.

Found this site on Sasquatch with some of the different native American names for him tribe by tribe. http://sasquatchresearch.net/sassynames.html

The Austrian Reinhold Mesner (first man on Mt. Everest without the help of additional oxygen) said that he once saw a Yeti, for a few seconds. There he talks about it (start at 0:50) :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zzjM18q0zQI

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reinhold_Messner

And here he says that the Yeti he saw was a kind of Tibetan bear:
http://www.spiegel.de/sptv/themenabend/0,1518,177583,00.html

And for the English speaking part of the forum: Here he also says that the Yeti he saw was a kind of Tibetan bear:
http://www.parascope.com/en/articles/yetiBear.htm


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yeti
>>>
In 1986, South Tyrolean mountaineer Reinhold Messner claimed to have a face-to-face encounter with a Yeti. He has since written a book, My Quest for the Yeti, and claims to have actually killed one. According to Messner, the Yeti is actually the endangered Himalayan brown bear, Ursus arctos isabellinus, that can walk upright or on all fours.

Thank you. I'd heard about this bear theory, and it is very plausible, if less enticing than the idea of a relict species. Reinhold Messner is an incredible mountaineer, the first man to climb all fourteen of the 8,000's, and part of that amazing tradition of alpinists from that region, from Toni Kurz to Uli Steck. You'd definitely have to take anything he said very seriously.

Standing Bear...Doesn't show much resemblance to Yeti or Bigfoot....but I suppose if standing in the brush...it could be mistaken for anything! I would love to know the results of the DNA study.

Interesting to note that Messner scaled Everest without the aid of oxygen, which makes me wonder if altitude sickness was responsible for the sightings, hallucination being one of the symptoms in oxygen deplete air. Admittedly this wouldn't explain away all sightings...

Here's a link to the Bigfoot Field Researchers Organisation. Not a bad site information wise (design/layout could use some work), but check out the latest Tweets from people reporting sightings/evidence and the geographic database - a nice little diversion from the norm.

http://www.bfro.net/

A similar page from Russia is below.
In the early '80's I truly saw the reported exhibit as seen in the photo left side, immediately assumed hoax, but now with the advent of the internet will never know if it was the discoverers proclaimed "mock-up" or tghe "real" frozen hairy hominid he shot dead and put on display.

http://www.hominology.narod.ru/iseman.htm







http://www.prairieghosts.com/iceman.html

Good point. According to this he also experimented with smoking hashish at high altitudes, which would also have quite an effect on an oxygen starved brain.



http://skepdigest.awardspace.us/parascope_yeti.html

I don't know how reliable that info above is, but regardless, he's still an absolutely incredible, phenomenal climber.



Nice site. I'd really like to go on one of those expeditions, just for the amazing landscapes and scenery.

Just had a quick read of that link TCJ, does seem to be a very expensive enterprise with little return, if indeed a real body ever existed. I'm assuming you saw it in Chicago?

This is a telling excerpt from Wiki: '...It should also be noted that, years before the creation of the Minnesota Iceman, Frank Hansen approached Universal Studios in a failed attempt to create a fake crashed flying saucer and aliens'

I saw it inadvertently on a visit to a "shopping mall" in Florida.
All the stories are full of holes, contradictory, and fantastical.
Hansen, who also showed me the Argosy article, gave me his story of the Japanese fishing boat ice-block finding.
When leaving, I discussed to my young son the importance of skepticism.
It's a dilly of a story though.

I voted "possible", btw.

Cajun country has their own tales too.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5KzeYrjfN9s

So you spoke to Hansen himself? I wonder what happened to him, he apparently vanished into thin air. Notice the Hansen's bought themselves a nice new bigfoot sized freezer just before the find; fortuitous...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5KzeYrjfN9s

Just the one eye then?

Reliable.
And why should he lie abouth something that only can diminish his reputation?
But as you said: regardless he's a phenomenal climber. Altering the state of mind doesn't lesson his abilities. And also he won't have seen Yetis or ghosts just because of smoking hemp.

It was all in all tacky looking. I left realizing that I'd been at a carnival show.

Yes, the man claimed he was the sole owner-caretaker. I'll assume it was Hansen I spoke with as web pages cite how protective he was of the whole affair. He ran a one-man show, no doubts.
The first page linked discusses his recent passing, his wife and son's secretiveness (to protect the innocent) and their annoyance.
The big hoot is the claim that Jimmy Stewart was the final owner and swore he'd never divulge and would destroy it. There's nothing left to look for.

Troy Landry's One Eye is further known elsewhere as Red Eye but has two of them in those stories. They are not rare tellings by any means.

I live on the edge of the Ocala National Forest, it's far western point is across the major highway three blocks from me and the wet vastness extends near to the Atlantic finally. The most renown large hominid story here will be of the impeccably respected preacher of the 1970's claiming quite an encounter with one.

It did say that 'others have intimated' but doesn't cite who those sources were, so it could be dubious; maybe in attempt to discredit the man.

I agree, i doubt smoking hashish on its own would induce visions of Yeti's but in an already mind altered state some natural fauna could be misinterpreted, especially on a cold, remote, windy mountain summit.

double post...

La controverse au sujet du Yeti, et de son existence ou pas, a deja ete tranchee par Herge. Chang et Tintin doivent leur vie a cette creature benevole.

I'd gone and read the second link and not the first, hence not realising Hansen had passed away. If it was a hoax and his missus was in on it she's not likely to reveal anything now, she's not likely to want to spend the rest of her days listening to people speaking ill of her late Husband; it's understandable i guess.

I did Like preacher Whatley's story and especially his quote: "I don't know. I guess I'm amused about it. But just one fact bothers me. Some people have already said I might be lyin' about what I saw. Well, I'll tell YOU that if I was going to LIE about something I'd make it something really GOOD."

Just looked up Ocala National Forest and it is lovely. Not sure Bigfoot and his friends could survive in such a small area, what is it, about 40 miles across not including the wetland areas?

The Forest is approximately 600 square miles, nothing like out those West, but much of it pretty impenetrable to the usual explorer. There's much more wilderness connected too and going beyond it's borders.
There's been a lot of bigfoot hoaxes here with the fake feet and gorilla costumes, so much in fact that one serious research group called off their efforts from disgust and lack of verifiable physical evidence.
The Myakka River skunk ape photos are a bit startling but some claim are no more than of an escaped zoo or circus primate although officials can find no reference to such happening.



Wiki..

Quote:
Sightings of the skunk ape go back to before Europeans arrived. Indian tribes such as the Creek, Cherokee, and Seminole all told stories of a creature that stood 5–8 feet tall and gave off a pungent odor. When Europeans arrived, they learned of the legends from the Native Americans. They reported that these creatures were dangerous towards white people and friendly towards the Indians. A famous example of this reportedly occurred in the fall of 1822.


Quote:
In 2000, two photographs of an alleged ape, said to be the Skunk Ape, were taken anonymously and mailed to the Sarasota Sheriff's Department in Florida. They were accompanied by a letter[3] from a woman claiming to have photographed it on the edge of her backyard. The photographer claimed that on three different nights the ape had entered her yard to take apples from a bushel basket on her porch. She was convinced it was an escaped orangutan. The police were dispatched to the house numerous times but when they arrived the Skunk Ape, also known as the stink ape, was gone. The pictures have become known to Bigfoot enthusiasts as the "skunk ape photos".[4]

Loren Coleman is the primary researcher on the photographs, having helped track down the two photographs to an "Eckerd photo lab at the intersection of Fruitville and Tuttle Roads" in Sarasota County, Florida.

Around the size of London then, certainly puts it into perspective. I could see how a smaller species might survive undetected, but not one as big as a large primate...

Interesting to note that sightings of the Skunk Ape increased in the late 60's/70's, i wonder what conditions were like at this time? Maybe bad weather and ultimately food shortages may have forced more animals into urban areas which may well account for the sightings.


Graphic of Bigfoot sightings by state - what on earth is going on in Washington?!

Our lovely Forest is also renown as a hide-out for escaped convicts, a favorite for illegal drug manufacturing and growing, a refuge for groups of "survivalists" and "militiamen' of a violent anti-government nature (neo-nazis etc.) and if they can remain undiscovered who knows how long a large crypto-beast could.
The food chain supports the largest alligators, black bear and Florida panthers and there's no shortage of them. To be honest, I'm still skeptical on anything beyond escaped modern primates being around here. Those or a faked costume can explain all. The Myakka creature was identified as an Orang by more than one seeming expert sometime ago.



Much, much less human activity and land usage was seen in years prior to that. Those are in fact real estate boom years. The place of my early childhood was brand new suburban adjacent to one plot of pasture land which gave way to deep swamps. Today, you'll find Disney World there.

Amazing looking and sounding forest, seems very exotic compared to here, but quite forbidding as well, given some of the wildlife. The only US woods I've been to were in the north-east, VT and NH, but even there I was struck by how thick and dense and impenetrable they seemed compared to the small patches of mostly managed woodland here in England. Like what we'd call a thicket, but stretching for miles and miles.

I agree an escaped primate of some sort would be the most likely candidate in this case.

We don't have yetis / bigfeet, or escaped primates. Just a very few black cats roaming the moors; and escaped Chinese barking deer (muntjacs) breeding like mad in the south, after some escaped from a zoo.